How do you feel about people making fun of white girls? Is it misogyny masked by race privilege or should the girls just get over it and just deal with being picked on for being white and a girl?
When white guys make fun of white girls it’s pretty much never ok. That’s almost always just misogyny. I’ve seen that shit before and it’s pretty transparent. White men have privilege over white women, so it’s pretty obvious what they’re doing.
When women of color do it, it’s pretty much always justified because it almost always a commentary on white privilege, not internalized misogyny. Like I’ve seen women of color call white women ugly as a way of challenging euro-centric beauty standards. I’ve also seen woc criticize white women’s racialized misogyny and racism—and all of that is completely valid. It usually doesn’t matter how “mean” it may seem or how “angry” they are because they have a right to be angry.
When it’s men of color I think it’s more complicated. Sometimes, it’s a commentary on whiteness and the racialized misogyny white women and white feminists perpetuate. Sometimes it’s disguised misogyny. I think it just depends. But I also think it’s important to remember that in many contexts, white women have privilege over men of color. We are paid more for the dollar in the US, for one thing. And are often valued over men of color. And moc are not the source of the kyriarchy (in western societies at least).
But misogyny specially tailored for white women is not something I spend a lot of time worrying about, tbh. The misogyny women of color face is a lot more virulent than white women’s—like any brand of misogyny specially tailored to us is going to be much more benign than what woc experience. So to me, it would be fucked up to spend a lot of time worrying about this special misogyny for white women, when white femininity privileges us over woc. And to me it’s discouraging that white women NEVER want to talk about white female privilege and how being a white women in this society privileges us over woc but we’ll jump at the chance to talk about these “white girl jokes”—that’s why this conversation has the potential to go bad places. I mean how much “picking on” could a white girl be experiencing from these “white girl” jokes unless she’s going out of her way to impose herself in POC’s conversations and be an asshole (assuming it’s not white dudes doing it?)
Like feel free to call out some white dude if he’s being an ass, or a man of any race if he’s being sexist toward you personally, but if your feminism is fixated on this issue over others, it sounds white-centric to me. We should be thinking about how misogyny impacts all women and recognizing that our whiteness gives us more value in a white-supremacist society.
Don’t ever try to convince me about the poor circumstances carefree white women like this one experiences because “a white girl walked into class 10 minutes late with a pumpkin spice latte from starbucks” when it comes to racism.
a) You, yourself, are white and are a woman (or are generally perceived as such whether or not that is accurate to your identity)
b) You, yourself, are making “LOL WHITE GIRLS AMIRITE?” jokes, statements, or mockeries of likes/dislikes/priorities that are specifically NOT likes, dislikes, or priorities that apply to you…
I suggest you think real long and hard about the intersection of performative allyship and internalized misogyny. Especially if your entire “WHITE GIRLS AMIRITE” sounds exactly like a sexist dudebro’s “WOMEN AMIRITE” and you are trying to portray yourself as the Exceptional (Woke) White Girl Who Is NOT LIKE THE OTHERS.
Because I’ve been seeing this all over the place for the past couple years now and it’s obnoxious and gross.
[Photo id: a screenshot of an Instagram post. There is a picture of braided challah cooling on a wire rack with a caption reading, “Everybody say Challah!!! Soft sweet delicious challah bread, yum! It’s still a few months early for Shabbat I believe but its always great to learn ahead of time! This is my first time braiding dough and I think it turned out pretty nice! End id]
Mitch Marner endures his teammates’ “white girl at Starbucks” jokes because he genuinely likes the “white girl” drinks. If it doesn’t have caramel, it’s a waste of his time. His teammates don’t know what they’re missing.
now that I’ve driven home and had a few minutes to cool off and collect my thoughts, I feel I should explain myself to the people who have been following me and know who i am so I don’t damage my relationship or reputation more than I probably already have.
there was a post that an autistic person I follow made, where he vented about bigotry against autistic people, and ended with a passive aggressive “…janice”. there was another post that a nonbinary person I follow made where they vented about bigotry against gender nonconforming people, and ended with a passive aggressive “…denise”. I’m not 100% sure which was which but I DEFINITELY remember the posts, as well as the profile pictures of the people who posted them. I don’t remember the urls though, and even if I did remember them I wouldn’t list them in case the people who are now harassing and spamming me in my inbox and activity feeds decided to also hop on their [proverbial] dicks as well as mine because they apparently culturally appropriated those post templates, of ending extended rants about various bigots and ending them with names befitting of middle aged suburban soccermoms, karen.
now, when listing people of this demographic, I used to include white among those adjectives. however, there are black middle aged suburban soccermoms, hispanic middle aged suburban soccermoms, and asian middle aged suburban soccermoms, and pretty much people of every race who have the potential to be this type of person the practice strawmans. obviously not every single middle aged suburban parent of children who participate heavily in after school activities is going to be the type of person to scream at retail workers or starbucks baristas or people who cut off their minivans when they’re driving 15 under the speed limit in the left lane. not every single middle aged suburban person is an undeducated bible thumping bigot with their head shoved up their ass. not every one of them is a problematic piece of shit that stands by the #alllivesmatter crew or trump or whatever the republicans are rallying around this week. not even all of the white ones, and there are some people who fit the trope who are not white. I’ve dealt with many of them during my days at target, but I always stood by including white. until recently.
when I learned it made black people uncomfortable when white people made white jokes, I was of course initially hesitant. “that’s fucking stupid!” I though. “I’m not assuaging white guilt by doing this, I’m just finding it in me to laugh at myself”. and then I read a bit more about the subject and figured it isn’t worth the potential heartache if I fought it because in all honesty it kind of makes sense. my mom’s boyfriend’s son is black (and hispanic), and I had once made a white girl joke to my sister in front of him and mom told me later that both he and her boyfriend were uncomfortable with me saying that. after seeing the post that talked about it, and my… slight breakdown where I may have dramatically overreacted… I decided to try and stop with the white people jokes because I want to unlearn all of the racist shit that my dad, stepmom, aunts, uncles, grandparents, former friends, former acquaintances, and society in general that I possibly could, because racism as a concept digs into my skin and fucks me up.
it used to make me absolutely seethe with rage, and I still get a little steamed by it. in fact I once got in a LOT of trouble with my high school sociology student teacher because I got really shitty with her when she- an anthropology student no less- kept calling one kid in our class by his initial because apparently kudsai is just Too Hard™ to pronounce. one day, an off day where I forgot to take my medicine, she called him that and I yelled at her “he has a name, so use it”. granted I didn’t like the kid. I thought he was annoying; loud, obnoxious, constantly making sex jokes while we were studying freud (and even the fucking holocaust), in the choir and the football team… basically like any other cishet teenage boy. but being annoying is no excuse for a teacher to not take five fucking seconds of her day to learn how to say his name right just because it wasn’t franklin or gregory, two of the other black kids who I went to school with. anyone following me as far back as when annie got remade with quvenzhane wallis as the titular role might have read my thoughts on the matter of pronouncing people’s names right. i’m not saying this to pat myself on the back for not being racist, because WOW was I a rough mess of things back then, but I was never like my dad’s side of the family about race. back when michael brown’s death and ferguson were still talked about, I found myself agreeing with rush limbaugh about some of the things he said, so clearly I haven’t been a perfect angel my whole life.
anyway, back to white people jokes making black people feel uncomfortable. I’ve been trying to make myself agree with that, which as anyone who has the syndrome formerly known as aspergers can probably attest to, is hard as shit to do. possible but hard. like, I’m even now still unlearning some acephobia, transphobia, queerphobia, islamophobia, and even though I know the occasional fleeting thoughts that I think are wrong and bad, they still happen very frequently. same goes with various forms of racism and xenophobia. my dad (and former stepdad’s) influences are probably so deep because of various issues with abandonment and abuse that I’m not gonna discuss here, and they’re both absolutely reeking with white supremacist microaggressions. so I’m definitely trying my hardest.
part of that is why I reacted so negatively when people misinterpreted what I said, put words in my mouth, and straight up told me to kill myself in all of these messages that are still flooding in. another part is because I truly do stand by the things that I meant to say, rather than the things that it appears I’ve said. I really do think that it’s unreasonable to say that it’s racist for people who aren’t black to make posts where we vent about various injustices we face from people who are misinformed and ignorant and straight up smarmy condescending assholes and then end it with a passive aggressive name of some baby boomer fuckwit, peggy. because these baby boomer fuckwits come in many colors (black people are still capable of being racist [against hispanic/asian/etc people, not whites, I need to make that abundantly clear], classist, misogynist, queerphobic, ableist, otherwise bigoted prejudiced assholes), and these names that are heralded as “typically white”, like henry or franklin or gregory or harold or penelope or alice or etc, are not exclusively white names. I’ve seen or met black people with names like this and while it’s definitely not the majority (not even close), and it’s definitely partially due to cultural erasure perpetuated by gentrification, it still exists. so it doesn’t make sense to me why the person who wrote the post that started me on this whole sequence of posts about this topic insisted that it was a ‘white people names’ thing. especially when white people names are more like khaeylieghhe or miakkaylia or annedeeye or some other ridiculous bastardisation of english language in order to make your child feel special and unique and end up growing to be a cookie cutter member of the conservative party that tries to take down affirmative action because they feel like it’s reverse discriminatory or some shit. if it was something like that, making fun of those names that are actually like making jokes at the expense of white people [I think I should apologize in advance because technically this counts as a white people joke even if it’s just an example] would make perfect sense. however I have not only seen posts in this template of ending with baby boomer names being used as tools to express their distaste in queerphobia, ableism, classism, xenophobia, and intolerance of other sorts, but I’ve made them before, and it has had not a god damn bit of racial connotation to it at all unless it’s been specifically a black millennial on tumblr venting specifically about a white people-ism, and to make a post that shits on everybody who uses this template to cope if they’re not black, and causes those kids who use it to cope to ask why not, and then get immediately shit on by assholes who treat them just like people are treating me, who tell them that it doesn’t matter if they’re neurodivergent or gay or trans or whatever because they’re being Big Bad Evil Racists™ by ending their rant posts with names like becky, allison.
I don’t care if you’re black. if you treat queer or disabled kids like shit and call them racist when they’re not being racist, no matter what color your skin is, you’re an asshole. and to act like fucking salem massachusetts when confronted with legitimate criticism of your ill-informed unbridled assault of an angry mama bear to queer and disabled kids, is just DISGUSTING. WEAK. and PATHETIC. and only serves to strengthen my points.
so you know what, go ahead. keep sending me your hate anons. keep sending me the smarmy condescension. I can take it. just stop being fucking assholes to my family. your race isn’t something I have any authority over but I won’t let you use it as a weapon to beat people over the head with just because you get high off of the power you get from the veil of anonymity. false accusations of being a tier 6 skinhead is more palatable than telling us to kill ourselves.
im texting my (white) friend and complaining about how society is past the need for angsty white boys in media and she just went "fuck off i will always need an angsty white boy" and i just. i hate it here. as a POC i just want more POC friends because every single white person will say something like this to me no exception
white girls will joke about pale emo white boys who eat cigarettes for breakfast being so sexy and then turn around and tell me to go back to mexico