Imagine being Viserys’s wife and queen of the Seven Kingdoms where you are known for your feisty yet caring nature.
♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡ ♡
\ Request from anonymous /
You have no idea how much I’ve missed your imagines!! I was wondering if you could do an AU plot where Viserys is Lord of the Seven Kingdoms and the reader is ruling with him as his Queen? ♥ Hope you’re having a wonderful week and thanks in advance, darling~!
He looked at her and sneered. “Dothraki rags. Do you presume to dress me now?” “Please…you’ll be cooler and more comfortable, and I thought…maybe if you dressed like them, the Dothraki…” Dany did not know how to say it without waking his dragon. “Next you’ll want to braid my hair.” Why was he always so cruel? She had only wanted to help. “You have no right to a braid, you have won no victories yet.” It was the wrong thing to say. Fury shone from his lilac eyes…
I’m requesting a Daenerys fluff in which the reader and her were friends in Pentos before she got married to Khal Drogo and get reunited when the reader is the only other female sailor on Yara Greyjoy’s crew cause I live for dany!
Sorry if you've been asked before, but what are your theories on Varys's plans for a Targ restoration? I thought he wanted Viserys on the iron throne until I read ADWD and realized that they prepared Aegon far more than they ever did Dany or her brother. In hindsight, the Targ siblings seem almost disposable to Varys and Illyrio--like they never expected either of them to take back Westeros. What were they planning????
In hindsight, the Targ siblings seem almost disposable to Varys and Illyrio
This is true.
like they never expected either of them to take back Westeros.
This is also true!
What were they planning?
Well, I’ll explain. But the text is (as always) where we start:
“I warn you, the wolf and lion will soon be at each other’s throats, whether we will it or no.” “Too soon, too soon,” the voice with the accent complained. “What good is war now? We are not ready. Delay.” “As well bid me stop time. Do you take me for a wizard?” […]
“Perhaps so,” the forked beard replied, pausing to catch his breath
after the long climb. “Nonetheless, we must have time. The princess is
with child. The khal will not bestir himself until his son is born. You know how they are, these savages.” […] “If he does not bestir himself soon, it may be too late,” the stout man in the steel cap said.
–AGOT, Arya III
overheard conversation between Varys and Illyrio is the first major
clue as to what they were planning with Viserys and Dany. They wanted to
start a war in Westeros, with Khal Drogo and his forty thousand
Dothraki warriors attacking on behalf of Dany and their son. But not so
soon – they needed to wait for something (or someone) to be ready. Unfortunately, all the intrigue with Jaime and Cersei (their incest nearly being revealed; pushing
Bran), Joffrey’s blundering
(sending an assassin to finish the job with Bran), and Littlefinger’s manipulations (poisoning Jon Arryn; the lie about the assassin’s dagger) soon had Stark and Lannister fighting, a war that Varys and Illyrio did not want.
note that just because Varys and Illyrio wanted Drogo to attack
Westeros on behalf of Dany and their son, that doesn’t mean they
expected Dany (or even Viserys) to be there:
“If truth be told, I did not think Daenerys would survive for long amongst the horselords.“ “That did not stop you selling her to Khal Drogo…” “Dothraki neither buy nor sell. Say rather that her brother Viserys
gave her to Drogo to win the khal’s friendship. A vain young man, and
–ADWD, Tyrion II
brother was miserable out here. He ought never have come. Magister
Illyrio had urged him to wait in Pentos, had offered him the hospitality
of his manse, but Viserys would have none of it. He would stay with
Drogo until the debt had been paid, until he had the crown he had been
promised. “And if he tries to cheat me, he will learn to his sorrow what
it means to wake the dragon,” Viserys had vowed, laying a hand on his
borrowed sword. Illyrio had blinked at that and wished him good fortune.
–AGOT, Daenerys III
So, Illyrio straight up says he didn’t expect Dany would survive. Also
Illyrio is a smart man who understood Viserys extremely well – and it
doesn’t take much reverse psychology to say the kind of words (“living
with the Dothraki will be so hard, why do that when it’s so much easier to
stay here in comfort” that would play on Viserys’s vanity and impression of himself as a warrior-king
to send him on a doomed mission out on the Dothraki sea as well.
But if by chance they did survive:
“Which plan?” said Tristan Rivers. “The fat man’s plan? The one that
changes every time the moon turns? First Viserys Targaryen was to join
us with fifty thousand Dothraki screamers at his back. Then the Beggar King was dead, and it was to be the sister, a pliable young child queen who was on her way to Pentos with three new-hatched dragons. Instead the girl turns up on Slaver’s Bay and leaves a string of burning cities in her wake, and the fat man decides we should meet her by Volantis. Now that plan is in ruins as well.”
–ADWD, The Lost Lord
other things, we see that the Golden Company was supposed to join
Viserys and Drogo and the Dothraki in their attack on Westeros. The same
Golden Company who Viserys once feasted and asked to fight for him, and
who heard his pleas and laughed at him. So what’s the situation here?
truth is in the origins of the Golden Company, a mercenary company
founded by Aegor “Bittersteel” Rivers and various Westeros exiles to
bring House Blackfyre to the Iron Throne. Because Varys and Illyrio’s
plan is not for a Targaryen restoration – but a Blackfyre restoration.
Viserys and Dany were disposable to them. The Dothraki invasion was
only meant to inflame the people of Westeros further against the
children of the Mad King, to cause chaos and destruction with their
“savage” “barbarian” ways… until the Golden Company turned and
destroyed them (with the help of a select group of Westeros lords),
under the leadership of the true king, the perfect prince, Rhaegar’s son
Aegon Targaryen, miraculously saved from his death in infancy… except he’s not. Aegon is truly a Blackfyre, almost certainly Illyrio’s son with his wife Serra, a daughter of the lost female line of House Blackfyre.
no-one would know the truth (except Varys and Illyrio and the leaders
of the Golden Company), and all would think him a true Targaryen. And if
Dany by some miracle did manage to survive all her troubles, then she
would surely marry Aegon – ever so grateful for him rescuing her from
her abusive mad brother and her savage Dothraki husband – and cinch his
legitimacy, since even with Westeros impressed by his heroism, some
might still think he might be a pretender due to his secret upbringing.
But as Daenerys’s history is very public and not at all in doubt by
anyone, this marriage would be the fitting resolution of this glorious
“What is a mummer’s dragon, pray?” “A cloth dragon on poles,” Dany explained. “Mummers use them in their follies, to give the heroes something to fight.”
–ACOK, Daenerys V
yes, Viserys was always disposable. Even if he survived the Dothraki,
he was always meant to be a patsy, the “mummer’s dragon” for the hero
Aegon to fight. But really it’s Aegon, Varys’s false Targaryen, who’s
the actual mummer’s dragon:
A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd… mother of dragons, slayer of lies…
–ACOK, Daenerys IV
the girl that Illyrio thought would die in the Dothraki sea, who was
reborn in blood and fire, is the one who will slay that lie at last.
I’ve been wondering what, if anything, we can learn from the names of Aerys II and Rhaella’s children. What did their names mean to their parents and the Seven Kingdoms, and what do their names mean to GRRM? In this series, where names and identity mean so much, I figured this would be an interesting topic to look into. So let’s get right to it. We’ll start with…
Rhaegar: Rhae- is a common beginning for many Targaryen names, especially female ones. Obviously, there’s Rhaegar’s mother Rhaella, her aunt Rhaelle, the conquering Rhaenys as well as Princess Rhaenys the Queen Who Never Was, and then there’s Rhaenyra, Aegon V’s sister Rhae, and Rhaena, who was one of the three Maidens in the Tower.
The only male Targaryen I can find who has a Rhae-name is Prince Rhaegel, who was Aegon V’s uncle and therefore kind of distantly related to baby Rhaegar. Also, as he was known for being “meek, mad and sickly” it seems unlikely Rhaegar would have been named for him.
The –ar ending can be found in some Targaryen names, though it’s not as common as –on or –ys as an ending. We see it in King Maekar’s name (Rhaegar’s great-great-grandfather), and there’s Prince Valarr.
The only –gar ending I see in Targaryen name history is actually that of Visenya’s dragon Vhagar, who by the time of the Dance of the Dragons was the oldest and most ferocious living dragon in Westeros, almost as large as the infamous Balerion. I mean that’s pretty cool, but I don’t see any other cases of Targaryens being named after their dragons.
So the best I can come up with for Rhaegar’s name is that it just seems to be a combination of Targaryen name beginnings and endings. He doesn’t seem to be named after anyone, at least not in the way that his siblings clearly are. What does this tell us? Perhaps after the tragedy of Summerhall, Rhaegar’s birth represented new life and new hope for the Targaryen line, so the forging of his name went along with that. Instead of being named after someone else, as were his mother and father and grandfather and great-grandfather & many others before him, Rhaegar represents an entirely new Targaryen trajectory. Or so his parents thought…It is possible that GRRM chose this name for similar reasons.
Viserys: As we know, Viserys styles himself the Third of his Name because there were two others of that name. Viserys II was one of Rhaenyra’s sons. He is known as a good Hand but a bad King. His reign was brief and fraught with accusations that he’d poisoned Baelor I in order to take the throne. The first Viserys was known as a good ruler, legendary for grooming his daughter Rhaenyra to be his heir. Again, it’s hard to say why our Viserys III’s his parents chose this name. Perhaps by the time he was born in AC 275, it had just been too long since there was a Viserys in the family. It’s interesting to note that while both past Viseryses (how exactly does one make this name plural hahah) were good at what they did, their times in power are associated with scandal (the Dance of the Dragons pitted Viserys I’s children against one another; Viserys II allegedly poisoned the previous king).
So, perhaps we could say that GRRM chose the name Viserys to emphasize the ambiguity surrounding Viserys Targaryen, Third of his Name. I know Viserys gets a lot of hate in the fandom, and a lot of his behavior is worthy of condemnation, but there is always the what if? that lingers when discussing Viserys. What if his life had worked out differently? After all, being hurriedly smuggled away from your home, being suddenly orphaned at an old enough age (nine) to understand and feel the weight of what is happening, then being smuggled away from that home with a baby and having to live on the run with said baby for most of the rest of your life, hearing nothing from your allies but that the rebellion took away what was yours and killed your father and brother…I don’t know, I think it’s easy to see how all this might affect someone’s ability to think fairly and rationally. (Remember also despite the fact that we know we need to be critical when thinking about Rhaegar’s actions, and we know exactly what kind of person Aerys II had become, Viserys didn’t know these things. He was a kid and Rhaegar was his older brother, and Rhaella tried to keep Viserys unaware of the extent of his father’s madness as best she could. Viserys lost his brother, father and mother in pretty rapid succession.) It absolutely does not justify Viserys’s abuse of Dany, yet we must understand how his ability to be a good rational thinker and leader would be impaired by his bitterness and exhaustion and homelessness and loneliness. So maybe being named after these two Viserys Targaryens of the past shows us that just like they are associated with both bad and good, us readers ought to see Viserys as ambiguous as well instead of deciding he’s the villain and never sparing him a second thought.
Daenerys: So it recently occurred to me to wonder: Who named Daenerys? Though we don’t know and probably never will, I think there’s a good chance that Rhaella named her on her own. Who else would have? Since we know so little about Rhaella, I wondered what we can learn about her from her choice to name her only daughter Daenerys, which was probably the last decision she ever made.
The first Daenerys is someone I associate with unification. It is her marriage to Maron Martell that finally united the Seven Kingdoms, joining Dorne politically to the rest of Westeros. Since Dany was born amongst the bloodshed of the Rebellion, was Rhaella thinking about an end to war when she held her baby daughter? We’ll never know, but it is possible.
As far as GRRM’s choice to name her Daenerys goes, our Dany has much in common with Daenerys I. By all accounts, Daenerys I was beautiful and somewhat generous, letting the children of the servants and guards play with her children in the Water Gardens (clearly a generous gesture by Westerosi standards, and something that’s kept up to this day).
And of course, there is the theme of unification. Dany is definitely trying to unite people in Essos, and the narrative is setting her up as a contender to sit the Iron Throne, a position which ideally would unite the Seven Kingdoms once more.
This is a bit of an odd question relating to world-building. Do you have advice when it comes to original swears? I've created a few different cultures and while one protagonist comes from similar origins as I do, the other is from one of the fictional worlds. A language teacher told me swears always come from taboos, but I'm not sure what types of taboos I should even be looking at -- The character I'm trying to have swear is a teenage boy. If you could please help me that would be wonderful.
Some bad language coming up, be warned.
World-building is always a big task where everything depends on everything else.
Your teacher is right that swears come from taboos. Sexuality was and to same extent still is a big taboo in our society. At worst it’s seen as immoral, dirty and shameful, at best it’s a really private thing. Hence, we have a shitload of insults that include the word “fuck” or refer to genitals. We also have lots of swears referring to defecating, again something that’s considered to be private and dirty. Religious-themed insults were a big thing because taking the name of God in vain is a big taboo. Fun fact, if you studied French, you may have heard some very old-fashioned swear words like “morbleu”, “parbleu” or more likely “sacrebleu”. These were originally “Mort de Dieu” (death of god), “par Dieu” (by God!) and “sacré Dieu” (sacred God). These were mostly used by the nobility until the Church decided to crack down and tell them they’re all going to hell, noble blood or not if they keep breaking the fourth commandment. The nobles decided to do what mothers everywhere do when they substitute “sugar” for “shit” and replaced “Dieu” (God) by the rhyming “bleu” (blue). And this is where the phrase “blue blood” comes from.
Similarly, offensive slurs appear because we start despising certain groups of people. Then when we realise how awful these views are, you start seeing more people banning these words from their vocabulary. Hence why we also have so many slurs against women, people of colour, LGBT or the disabled for example.
The cool thing with inventing a whole new world is you get to be a bit more original than our society tends to be. You get to move away from sex-related insuts and variations of shit and away from offensive slurs that plague our swearing patterns.
There are actually really good examples of how world-building influences insults in George RR Martin’s A Song of Ice and Fire. When Daenerys and her abusive brother Viserys are living with Khal Drogo, Viserys soon becomes despised among the Dothraki. He earns himself too “nicknames” which are meant to be insulting. The first one is Khal Rae Mhar (“the sorefoot king”) and the second is Khal Raggat (”the cart king”). The first one is given to him when he is punished for his assault on Daenerys, now a khaleesi of the Dothraki, by having his horse taken away and is forced the walk. Later, Khal Drogo offers him to ride in a cart, which Viserys takes to be an apology, but is actually an insult as being able to ride a horse is hugely important among the Dothraki and those who cannot ride are despised. Much later, at a feast, a drunken Viserys demands to know why he isn’t being seated at a place of honour. To which Khal Drogo responds “Nevakhi vekha ha maan: Rekke, m'aresakea norethi fitte.” (There is a place for him: over there with the short-haired cowards). Since the Dothraki cut off the hair of defeated enemies, being short-haired means you’re a loser. Hence why the term “short-haired” appears as an insult in association with “coward”.
These three insults come directly from important taboos of the Dothraki culture. As nomadic horse-riding warriors, the two things they cannot be without shame is someone who cannot ride or someone who gets defeated in battle.
On the flipside of that coin, Viserys does insult the Dothraki by telling Dany they’re primitives who do not build anything, but just steal the things greater men have made. Look at what that means in terms of what their different cultures value. Viserys comes from a culture that values building and property. Drogo on the other hand is from a culture that values victory. Viserys will be a king when he sits his ass on a throne and gets to say “that country belongs to me”. Drogo is a king because he wins battles, wherever he is in the Dothraki Green Grass Sea. To Drogo, the magnificent statues at Vaes Dothrak, the Dothraki city, are spoils of war and as such are evidence of the Dothraki superiority in courage and strength. Viserys on the other hand sees it as petty stealing and the spoils are proof of the greatness of the men who built them, not of the men who won them in battle.
So think about what that boy’s culture is. Where does he come from, what kind of place is it geographically speaking? That can tell you what might be important to their survival, which can lead to showing what might be important to them in general. What are their values?
For example, if he comes from a nation that lives by the sea, chances are they need to place a lot of emphasis on fishing and sailing. Maybe their religion has a lot of sea gods. Maybe they despise people who fish in rivers because that’s not real manly men fishing that requires knowing how to sail a boat on the big bad sea. In which case “fresh water fisherman” can be an insult.
Hope this gives you a general idea of where to start.
Hello! I've just finished watching season one of got and was wondering of you coud tell me a bit about viserys (I hope I spelled that right) since you seem to really like him :)
Hi there!!!! Ahh wow, where do I even begin?
Viserys is hands down one of my favourite ASOIAF characters. Yes, he was a little shit approximately 800% of the time, but he was my little shit, and as a character he is both very important and very, very, well written.
So my little homeboy was unfortunately thrown into some very unfortunate circumstances when he was a young boy (on the show he was 5 during the sack of King’s Landing in Robert’s Rebellion, but in the books he was closer to 8 years old) since Robert’s Rebellion was just not a good time at all for any Targaryen.
The TL;DR version of Robert’s Rebellion is basically that his older brother, the crown prince Rhaegar, was killed on the Trident by Robert Baratheon, Tywin Lannister - who was the former hand of the king - betrayed the king’s trust and attacked King’s Landing and everyone in it, Jaime Lannister aka Kingslayer killed Viserys’ father King Aerys in cold blood, and Viserys and his then-pregnant mother Rhaella were forced to escape to Dragonstone.
Rhaella unfortunately died giving birth to Daenerys, and after the events of Robert’s Rebellion Viserys and his newborn baby sister were seemingly the last of their 400-year-old dynasty.
Ser Willem Darry, who was a Targaryen loyalist, smuggled them out to the free cities before Stannis Baratheon attacked Dragonstone, and they lived across the narrow sea pretty comfortably until Ser Willem died and Viserys and Dany were kicked out by the servants.
They eventually had to beg in the streets to survive, and Viserys ended up having to sell his mother’s crown - which was the last thing he had to remember her by - just so they could eat, and he quickly earned the nickname “Beggar King”.
Anyway, now that we have some back-story, let’s take a look at why Viserys is important and people need to pay more attention to him:
He became responsible for the life of his child sister when he himself was still a child and had no means of supporting them…
… because they were miles away from home across the narrow sea…
… and their entire family was dead…
Did I also mention that over the many years that Viserys and Daenerys lived across the narrow sea, Robert Baratheon constantly sent assassins after them?
He had the weight and responsibility of the 400-year-old Targaryen dynasty (the dynasty that built King’s Landing from the ground up and made Westeros what it was, mind you) on his shoulders from a very young age (5 or 8 take your pick neither one is better than the other).
So just to make sure we’re not lost yet: the responsibility of raising his child sister and also reviving literally the greatest dynasty Westeros has ever seen, while simultaneously trying to avoid and escape the countless attempts on his and his sister’s life thanks to Robert Baratheon.
The only consistent male figure Viserys had growing up was his father Aerys who is often called “The Mad King”. Imagine having to hear every day since you can remember that one of the only people you’ve ever looked up to and strived for approval from was literally batshit insane? To hear how he took joy from burning people alive and would act cruel and vicious for his own amusement? Viserys believed that it was true kingly behaviour to act that way - it was the only example of being a king he had to go on! When he got older and had to start “acting the part” so more people would take him seriously and support his claim he literally only had stories of his valiant brother Rhaegar and his insane father Aerys to go on.
Rhaegar! Viserys’ perfect and valiant older brother who was the epitome of charm and duty - the heartbreakingly beautiful crown prince who inspired dreamy eyes and lilting voices when someone would talk about him. Viserys heard how fondly others would speak of his brother, and when Dany was finally accepted by the Dothraki he could see how much they loved her and it infuriated him. It made him feel jealous, and hopeless, and would only remind of him how they would only ever speak ill of his father “The Mad King”, and call Viserys names like “Beggar King”. It would make him realise just how far away from home, and his goal, and his rightful throne, he really was.
Imagine being literally the rightful king to seven kingdoms, but nobody cared! Because someone organised a rebellion against your father and brother which subsequently led to the death of almost everyone in your house and you being torn from your home, and family, and the only life you’ve ever known. You have to rely on strangers and eventually yourself - you become desperate and hopeless in your longing for days that are far behind you. All you have is your little sister who can’t even be a familiar comfort of days past because she wasn’t even alive during the memories you long for. When Viserys looks at Daenerys, all he is reminded of is his mother’s death (similar to what we see happening between Cersei and Tyrion). He’s a warm and comforting brother to her at first, teaching her about their family and the dragons to keep the memories alive, letting her sleep in his bed when they were children when she had nightmares, but the crueler the world was to Viserys Targaryen, the crueler Viserys Targaryen became.
Viserys lives with the constant Targaryen dichotomy between madness and greatness. They say that when a Targaryen is born, the gods flip a coin. Will they be mad? Will they be great? It’s often unclear to the Targaryens themselves. Viserys mistook his father’s madness for greatness, and certainly mistook it within himself. I’m completely confident that he could feel his madness and what it was doing to him, but was so desperate for it to be greatness that he allowed himself to believe so until the moment he died.
“Who can rule without wealth, or fear, or love?” A very important Viserys quote, not to be overlooked. Viserys inspiring fear in people is how he believed he could control them. It’s what he learned from his father to do, again believing it to be kingly behaviour. Viserys had no wealth, not a penny to his name from the age of 8, everything he “owned” was borrowed from the kindness of strangers. Daenerys had love, the love of Khal Drogo and his Khalasar, the kind of love Rhaegar had from the people of Westeros, the kind of love Viserys knew he would never have. In his mind he was too much like his father, too destined to be too much like his father, so his only option was fear. Instilling fear into others was Viserys’ desperate way of playing king. “Even as a child, your brother Viserys oft seemed to be his father’s son, in ways Rhaegar never did.” [x]
Viserys plays a vital role in Dany’s personal growth and development as a character! We see how timid and submissive she is at the start of the story when Viserys is still alive, and her transformation of coming into her own isn’t complete until after Viserys has died. His death is a major catalyst for her development into the fierce and commanding Daenerys so reminiscent of Aegon the Conqueror we know and love today!
All things aside for a moment, I’d like to clarify that none of this means that I excuse the mental and physical abuse Dany suffered at the hands of her brother, nor the threats he placed against her. I’m simply offering a different perspective on things in the hopes that you all will see Viserys as more than just “Dany’s hilariously pathetic older brother”.
What I’d like everyone to take away from this is the understanding of what Viserys went through. He was just as mad as his father, and I completely believe that he was Aerys reborn, destined to the same fate of madness. Viserys was truly his father in more ways than one, but it is because of this that he should be pitied and loved. He was driven mad by years and years of bitterness, paranoia, anger, desperation, and degradation. Viserys Targaryen is the product of his environment, the kind of environment that strips away everything a frightened 8 year old child holds dear and continues to do so until he is at his sanity’s end.
As Daenerys so aptly put it, “His soul was starved to death.” [x]
This is not to prove Jaime/Brienne, this is not attempting to change opinions. This is to show we are not crazy and there's fucking book evidence!
“Jaime would never want to have sex with Brienne”
“She jerked to her feet as if he’d struck her, sending a wash of hot water across the tub. Jaime caught a glimpse of the thick blonde bush at the juncture of her thighs as she climbed out. She was much hairier than his sister. Absurdly, he felt his cock stir beneath the bathwater.”
I know looking at the private parts of people I don’t like turns me on all the time.
“Jaime doesn’t think Brienne is attractive at all”
““Blue is a good color on you, my lady,” Jaime observed. “It goes well with your eyes.” She does have astonishing eyes.”
I compliment unattractive stuff, too!
“He cut her off. “Take the bloody sword and go, before I change my mind. There’s a bay mare in the stables, as homely as you are but somewhat better trained.”
“Brienne’s mare was sweet to look upon and kept a pretty pace.”
You didn’t even try, Jaime.
“Jaime is still head over heels in love with Cersei!”
Jaime read it in the window seat, bathed in the light of that cold white morning. Qyburn’s words were terse and to the point, Cersei’s fevered and fervent. Come at once, she said. Help me. Save me. I need you now as I have never needed you before. I love you. I love you. I love you. Come at once.
Vyman was hovering by the door, waiting, and Jaime sensed that Peck was watching too. “Does my lord wish to answer?” the maester asked, after a long silence.
A snowflake landed on the letter. As it melted, the ink began to blur. Jaime rolled the parchment up again, as tight as one hand would allow, and handed it to Peck. “No,” he said. “Put this in the fire.”
~~Ain’t no lie, baby. Bye. Bye. Bye!
“Jaime doesn’t even think of anyone else but Cersei!”
“Unbidden, his thoughts went to Brienne of Tarth.”
I didn’t know Cersei had a name change!
“He was grateful when the bath was deep enough to conceal his arousal .
As he lowered himself into the steaming water, he recalled another bath , the one he’d shared with Brienne.”
“I have a boner…kinda like that time Brienne gave me a boner. Good times.”
“White,” she said, “but your hand is solid gold. I like that in a man. And what is it you like in a woman, m’lord?”
(remember that one time)
“His wife? ” Brienne said, appalled. “The Imp? But … he swore, before the whole court, in sight of gods and men …”
She is such an innocent. Jaime was almost as surprised, if truth be told, but he hid it better.
“Jaime only cares about Cersei!”
Ser Ronnet was a landed knight, no more. For any such, the Maid of Tarth would have been a sweet plum indeed. “How is it that you did not wed?” Jaime asked him.
“Why, I went to Tarth and saw her. I had six years on her, yet the wench could look me in the eye. She was a sow in silk, though most sows have bigger teats. When she tried to talk she almost choked on her own tongue. I gave her a rose and told her it was all that she would ever have from me.” Connington glanced into the pit. “The bear was less hairy than that freak, I’ll—”
Jaime’s golden hand cracked him across the mouth so hard the other knight went stumbling down the steps. His lantern fell and smashed , and the oil spread out, burning. “You are speaking of a highborn lady, ser. Call her by her name. Call her Brienne.”
I know that when I’m alone with a guy and he makes fun of someone I don’t care about I punch him in the face so hard he falls down.
“Jaime doesn’t want anyone but cersei!”
Lets look at the Pia Paradox
First, in A storm of swords (where Jaime does still want Cersei and her wind like fingers)
Sending her away had not been easy after that, but Jaime had done it all the same. I have a woman, he reminded himself.
(but now lets look at A feast for crows)
“Remember your vows. Pia is more fit for Tyrion’s bed than yours. “Fetch me soap and a stiff brush,” he told Peck. “Pia, you may leave us.”
not "OH NO she’s not Cersei, I can’t! He says no because he’s sticking to his vows now!
"Brienne’s judgement is clouded by her crush on him!”
Okay I really don’t feel like copy and pasting this cause seriously. Brienne is literally the most untrusting person in the series. Go back and reread where Jaime literally tells Brienne, and only Brienne, not even Cersei, what happened the night he killed the Mad King and then question Brienne’s judgement again. If you’re seriously going to tell me this girl spends the good portion of a book and a half not trusting him as far as she can throw him and then after seeing him naked and clean she has a crush on him and forgets all knowledge of his past you really don’t know Brienne.
“There are no happy endings in Game of Thrones!”
This might be true but you cannot deny that GRRM likes to work himself in parallels and themes and Jaime and Brienne’s story is littered in honor, and knightly chivalry, and both believing in the songs and stories. Not to mention they’re a delicious polar opposite of each other while being the same at their core. So there might not be a traditional happy ending but there’s a good hella chance it’s going to be a bittersweet ending along the lines of the songs of knights.
“WHY CAN’T A GUY AND A GIRL JUST BE FRIENDS!”
You. Are. On. Tumblr.
There are literally hundreds of ships where two attractive dudes look at each other for 2 seconds and then BAM
ARMADA OF A SHIP FORMED IN LESS TIME THAN IT TAKES THE EPISODE TO AIR
All I’m saying is why can’t a brother and a sister just be friends in the game of thrones fandom. Why’s it always gotta be incest? Why Viserys gotta feel Danny up and Theon finger Asha when he first meets her. I mean come on. Where’s the traditional platonic siblings at with deep family love? Watch Frozen, that shit is strong. It breaks curses just as good as romantic love.
So, stop hatin. Cause you can be friends and bang. You can not be friends and bang. You can be in love and never have sex. You can have sex and not be in love. (that sounds like Macklemore lyrics)
It's disappointing to watch the show producers and many in the show fandom hate on the female characters that GRRM respected and empathized with: Cersie, Sansa, even hating on Cat sometimes, only to love others for the traits he wanted us to question or outright didn't really attribute to them: Dany, Arya and Brienne for being "badass" (Yeah, killing totally wasn't a traumatic experience). Honestly, thank heavens for the actors and GRRM because they are the show’s salvation. D&D are hopeless.
Most if not all (Probably all) of the females in the fandom have had their character trashed by the show in some way.
Brienne telling Jaime he’s “acting like a bloody woman” when he gets his hand cut off. Delivering a nice and swift insult to Jaime because he’s moping and being “weak.” Despite the fact that in the books. Brienne respects and cares for women. (See Cat and Sansa) And has many feminine ideals herself. And your right, she doesn’t kill anyone until book four and she doesn’t like to do it. She gets sick right afterwards.
Asha or Yara using the word cunt, when she’s outright disparaging of the term in the books. Asha who values her mother because she taught her to be bold. (And of course naming her Asha because apparently people who watch the show are so stupid they will get her confused with Osha.)
Same for Arya in regards to viewing women as weak. I’ve also seen some well placed criticism that they are making her too “bad ass” and not focusing enough on the very real trauma that she suffered in the books.
Dany is a bit softer, and much less “they can live in my new world or die in their old one.” In the books. Less “but we are not men” and more “all men must die, but not for some time. let us pray.” (Though I will say that the show has made her more of a foot stamping brat. Her Qarth stroyline is complete and utter garbage in the show.)
One could say that they are stripping the feminine traits from these characters and are replacing them with what we can see as more traditionally “bad ass” traits. the woman warrior. (I mean it’s to the point that most people consider Dany a bad ass warrior, and she’s never held a sword in her life.)
Meanwhile your more traditionally feminine characters get hated on. Cersei is a bitch because she has traditionally masculine values like power, while being feminine and a mother. Catelyn should have loved Jon Snow, and shouldn’t oppose Robb. Melisandre is an evil seductress. Sansa should fight back.
We stripped away the feminine traits, or the way that our “heroic” females love other women and we teach the viewers that it’s okay to hate this other group of women. To be honest, there are so many parallels in the books between all these women.
Cersei and Dany are emotional, and headstrong, and paranoid. (Not to the same degree. But both spend a lot of time focusing on a certain prophecy of theirs.) They both have an overwhelming desire to be loved. They both love men they cannot be with.
Sansa and Dany and Cersei are all victims. Dany never fought back with Viserys until she was in a place where their power had shifted. Dany as Drogo’s wife suddenly had power within the Khalasar where as Viserys had none. That’s why she could fight back. Sansa never had that happen to her. Sansa never could fight her abusers because they were always in power. Cersei and Dany both killed their husbands (though the emotional response on it was different.)
Brienne and Sansa both value traditional feminine ideals and believe life should be like a song. They believe in true knights, and honor, even after life has taught them they shouldn’t they hold onto these ideals.
I could go on, and on, and on, but you’re right. The actors redeem the show. (And try and remember they can’t say bad things or contradictory things to the show. Though NCW should really keep his goddamn mouth shut when it comes to Dany.) The single episode GRRM gets to write is always good.
D&D are looking at a bottom line here. That isn’t to translate a faithful adaption, despite the books being far superior to the show. Most fans of the show, I will hazard a guess and say they haven’t read the books. So they will try and appeal to what the public thinks. They will strip away the feminine traits of the characters, and even pit us against the other women because society had taught us that’s okay.
Women who walk the razors edge between not having having so many feminine traits that they are “weak” but not having so many masculine traits that they are “bitches”. We say it’s okay to love these women and hate the others because frankly society wants to teach you it’s okay to hate women if they don’t behave a certain way. And it’s okay for women to hate other women. (Remember ladies, if we keep each other down, men don’t have to outright oppress us. We’ll do it for them.)
Which isn’t to say that this is D&D’s master plan. Suppress women everywhere. I’m saying that this is so engrained in our society that in order to produce a show where people will watch it they create these characters that would be unrecognizable to well fleshed out female characters of GRRM’s books.
“Do you see how long his hair is? When Dothraki are defeated in combat they cut of their braid so the whole world can see their shame. Khal Drogo has never been defeated. He’s a savage of course, but he is one of the finest killers alive.”
When Dany considers the Rebellion, she has nothing but scorn for Houses Baratheon, Stark and Lannister, but barely notes House Arryn, which is odd considering Jon Arryn was arguably the architect of the whole Rebellion. Do you suppose there's a reason for this related to how Willem Darry would have told the Targ kids the story, or is it an example of Dany's blinkered view of that period and her family's history?
Thanks for the question, Anon!
Keep in mind that Daenerys never had a maester growing up, or any parental figure after early childhood. The only Westerosi adult in her life before Jorah was Willem Darry, who died when she was all of four. Viserys was only seven/eight years older than his sister; his entire education likely stopped when he and his mother fled to Dragonstone, or at best when Willem Darry spirited him and baby Daenerys to Braavos. Comparatively speaking, that’s around the age Bran is at the start of A Game of Thrones - not totally ignorant of the history or current events of his country, but much more inclined to focus on stories and songs than history and politics.
Now, of course we know the Rebellion could not have happened without Jon Arryn. We know that the war really started when Aerys demanded the heads of Robert and Ned and Jon, being a loyal foster father and a not-deranged human being, refused and called his banners. But why would Viserys have know that? All he would have known from the war was what he would have been told - by his mad father, his tragic mother, or the (obviously) pro-Targaryen household. As Robert became more the symbolic leader of the rebellion - handsome, gregarious, a magnificent fighter and nearly universal victor of battles - Jon Arryn fell to the back. He was still important, of course - Jon led Vale troops at the Trident - but Robert and Ned became easier targets of focus. Both were young, and both had personal connections to the war (Robert losing his betrothed to Rhaegar’s abduction, Ned likewise losing his sister and then his father and brother to the Mad King).
The Baratheons, Starks, and Lannisters were, indeed, special objects of hate for the exiled Targaryens. Robert had murdered their heroic Rhaegar and claimed their crown for his house. Everyone knew Ned Stark was Robert’s best friend and partner-in-crime. And the Lannisters had crimson hands to match their crimson cloaks, stained with the blood of Aerys and Aegon, Rhaenys and Elia. Compared to them, Jon Arryn had not affected them directly, at least in no way that a young boy would understand. As his confusion solidified into hate over his long exile, Viserys focused more on those who had wronged the Targaryens (and him) personally - but not Jon Arryn. Those would be the lessons passed on to Daenerys.
Awesome Westerosi Characters You Don’t Know Because You Only Watch Game of Thrones: #25 Prince Quentyn Martell
Just so we’re clear: all the Martells are awesome. In the books, there is none of this “let’s murder a little girl” nonsense. My entry on Arianne Martell was the first in this series because I was so angry that she was cut.
But she wasn’t the only child of Doran Martell that got the ax. Doran had three children: Arianne, Quentyn and Trystane. Trystane is actually the one we know the least about. Both Arianne and Quentyn are POV characters with their own storylines. Trystane is just there. That’s why it’s so weird that Trystane is the only one being portrayed on the show.
As I mentioned in my Arianne entry, she had been promised as wife to Viserys Targaryen (which explains why didn’t marry his sister and ended up selling her to Khal Drogo). But Viserys was killed and now Quentyn has to woo Daenerys if he wants to keep his father’s plans on track.
Things might’ve turned out different if Quentyn caught up with Dany in Qarth, when she was looking for ships. By the time he gets to her, she is the embattled queen of Meereen. At that point, Dany hopes marrying Hizdahr zo Loraq might quiet the upheaval in the city. So she refuses Quentyn and tells him to go back to Dorne.
He does not. When Dany disappears on the back of Drogon, Quentyn gets it in his head that he could tame one of the remaining dragons. You’ll remember that Aegon the Conqueror’s sisterwives were both dragonriders as well and that is why the Targaryen dragon has three heads. Dany can only ride one dragon, and in theory at least, she could have two husbands to ride the other two.
Know what happens when you play with dragons? You get burned. Rhaegal bathed him in flame and he died after four days of agony. Barristan Selmy thinks it would’ve been better if Rhaegal had just eaten Quentyn.
It’s now unclear if Daenerys were to invade Westeros if she would have the support of House Martell or not. Certainly, Doran hates the Lannister leadership and wants revenge on those who killed his sister. But perhaps that will all be up to Arianne.
Image of Quentyn and Rhaegal by Ian Kirkpatrick Fantasy Flight Games.
#thank-god-this-didnt-included-dany-as-greatness-and-viserys-as-madness ooo why not? do u think dany has the madness in her? or are you just tired of seeing that in gifsets? sorry im just interested right now in everything got/dany lol
I’ll try not to make this long. But it is a complicated issue imo.
do u think dany has the madness in her?
Yes. Clearly she has the precursors, but what ultimately comes of that (if anything) I have no idea. I don’t know if you have read the books, so I am not sure how much I can say here.
or are you just tired of seeing that in gifsets?
YES. Exceptionally tired of it. Mostly cos it’s a cheap, uncreative interpretation of the quote but also cos it’s just on every other Viserys/Dany edit/gifset. Like enough already. It’s as bad as “My skin has turned to porcelain etc.”
Okay, I’ll cut the rest to be nice to people’s dashes ;)