tlok commentary

Legend of Korra: Korrasami

Transcript of DVD commentary from The Last Stand (final episode of Book 4) featuring Michael Dante DiMartino, Bryan Konietzko, Joaquim Dos Santos, and Lauren Montgomery.

BK: I like to imagine that Asami lied, she lied about Varrick wanting that suit just to get Tenzin out of there. She’s got this sly little look on her face and I think she’s like, “Yeah, it’ll buy me some time.“

JDS: Right now, Tenzin is going, "What, what, what, where is he?”

BK: So, yeah, Asami has had a pretty rough week or so… I don’t know, how much longer?

MD: It was a couple weeks.

BK: Couple of weeks, yeah. So, this was, you know, Mike and I worked on this scene together and I really wanted to have… I just loved their story, their whole how-they-started, you know, kinda fought over Mako… But what was cool is they never really took it out on each other, and then this beautiful relationship kind of developed out of it. So…

MD: Yeah, and we wanted to have them start as friends and have that friendship develop into maybe something a little more.

BK: Into love.

MD: Yes.

BK: And then there was- I always remembered, ‘cause Asami is not like the benders, so sometimes she wouldn’t be in the crazy action scenes and she never got to go to the spirit world. So, I thought…

MD: Yeah. It’s nice.

BK: It’s a beautiful way for them to go together and live happily ever after…the end.

LOK: The Last Stand DVD Commentary

Alright here we go! Mike and Bryan’s words on the Korrasami ending from the last episode.

Special note: This was recorded the day after they mixed the episode

The Last Scene

BK: I like to imagine that Asami lied about Varrick wanting that suit just to get Tenzin out of there. She’s got this sly little look on her face. She’s like, “Yeah, that’ll buy me some time." 

JDS: Tenzin’s now going, "What? Where is he?”

BK: So Asami’s had a pretty rough week or so.

MD: A couple weeks. 

BK: So yeah this, Mike and I worked on this scene together and I really wanted to have…I just loved their story, how they started, you know kinda fought over Mako but what was cool was that they never took it out on each other and this beautiful relationship developed out of it. 

MD: Yeah and we wanted them to start off friends and have that friendship develop into maybe something a little more.

BK: Into love.

MD: Yes. 

BK: I always remember Asami’s not the bender so sometimes she wouldn’t be in the crazy action scenes so she never got to go to the spirit world. A beautiful way for them to go together…live happily ever after…the end.


There are so many things I like about these few seconds of the conclusion of the finale. First, Korra is just so beat down and at the mention of the RL, you know she’s going to think back about all the terrible things that happened and she obviously has nightmares judging from the bags under her eyes. And when the MOST OBNOXIOUS PRESIDENT FUCKYOUIHATEYOU RAIKO is all, ‘good job gold star welcome back after i BANISHED you and i don’t even apologize’, I just want to cut him. And then Korra looks down and you know she doesn’t want to respond. She doesn’t want the praise or pity. That hurts to see. Seriously. And then Asami looks down at her and I am just so happy that their friendship has gotten so strong after these past three seasons. You can tell that Asami is her best friend in ways that Mako and Bolin could never be. And she wants to be there for her and not let anyone hurt her. IT HURTS. She wants to be able to make her feel better and bring her out of this awful situation she’s in.

And then you have Ikki who has been immature and selfish in the past, but she’s grown so much even though we haven’t seen her development that much. I feel like children have a certain emotional connection to people in the sense that they can sense when someone needs a little boost and Ikki just wants to do whatever to help Korra happy and make things easier for her.

AND THEN MEELO. He just really makes me happy that he’s so eager to be with Korra. Obviously, each of the airbending babies have different connections with her, but Meelo’s moment with Korra was so sweet. I know a lot of people have commented on the way that Korra lights up and smiles for him and I feel like it’s genuine of her. Meelo’s the type of boy who will make you smile no matter if it’s intentional or not. Korra needs that little bit of sunshine and I’m so so extremely happy that Bryke included this.

The thing about Kuvira’s defeat and surrender, is that it doesn’t make you feel satisfied..There is no triumphant moment you feel that the hero has won, the villain has lost, you just feel sad.

You feel sad for Kuvira.

And it’s not just because she came clean about her feelings over her tragic childhood. It’s the culmination of everything. Those exposed feelings were but the rain that finally brought the flower to bloom.

Almost everything about Kuvira’s life is a tragedy, and yes, that includes becoming the Great Uniter. To me, it’s kind of like a loss of innocence for her. She dedicated herself to a selfless cause, but her heart froze over in the process. She lost herself, that good, dedicated guard, to a cause that soon became more important to her than anything else. She went too far, she didn’t know when to stop, and she fell victim to the illusions of power and grandeur, all things she probably never expected to happen, and because of that, she became a machine.

But in there the whole time, had been this frightened little girl trying to make the world a less-frightening place.

 Look at her. She looks so pathetic here. The shell that encased her is crumbling, and that little girl is finally showing her face again, but she can’t go back anymore. She can’t go back and try to have a life again. Her life now, is essentially over. The consequences of a lost child finding a home in the wrong place.

Just think about it

Korra lost her bending in Book One. Katara tried everything she could, but she wasn’t able to restore Korra’s connection to the elements. The master healer was everyone’s last resort, so it seemed no one would be able to help Korra—until Aang showed up. He told her the importance and significance of what she was going through, gave her back her bending, and Korra was able to go into the Avatar for the first time.

At the beginning of Book Four, Korra is seen struggling with PTSD, and she couldn’t even walk. Her connection to her past lives was severed, and no one was able to help her take that first step to heal—no one, that is, except Katara. She was patient and understanding, and played a big part in both Korra’s physical and emotional recovery.

Katara and Aang have both helped pull Korra up from her lowest points in her life, doing what the other cannot. They are
both very minor characters in LoK, but their impact on Korra, roles in her life, and contribution to her development are without a doubt invaluable.

Now that we’re talking about shipping.. all 4 of us in this room, we’re too old for that. Not that we’re better than it, it just doesn’t relate to us. People have to explain it to us. When I watch TV shows, that’s not how I interact with them. I’m not saying it’s wrong; I don’t think about these characters getting together if the story’s not going that way. But, I found myself shipping Mako with the operator woman that he’s sitting next to during the evacuation. He’s like totally bombing, but I kinda think she’s like ‘that’s kinda cute.’ He’s like oblivious. He probably went back and he just called the operator.
—  Bryan Konietzko, Commentary on “Korra Alone”
A small theory (if you want to call it that)

At a recent panel, Janet Varney was asked about how it was to work with Zelda Williams, who voices Kuvira. 

Janet: “Oh, she’s great! Well, for one thing, I can’t believe that voice comes out of this little girl. She’s a beautiful small girl. Talk about great casting. Her voice is fantastic! So that’s the craziest thing about it. She’d probably be in the booth behind me and we would be recording. So I hear her really close in my headphones and I would hear her say something and sometimes I would have to be just like- you know, she’d be like, ‘You’re not going anywhere,' and I’d be like, 'That’s you! Do you know that’s you?’”

Source: X

I might be stretching a little, but I think Janet could have perhaps given us a line. It’s possible that she was just giving an example, but what if Kuvira actually says, “You’re not going anywhere”? I have to say, it’s make a lot of sense. 

I feel like it’s fair to assume that the plot next episode will be about Bolin trying to escape before he’s sent to the re-education camp (this could be up in the air but it’s likely), Suyin and her sons getting caught in their raid, and Korra and Kuvira facing off. 

So, I also feel safe in assuming that between those three conflicts, all 22 minutes will be used. 

By analyzing the scenes from the trailer, we have a pretty good idea of how the fights occurs. Here’s the order that it looks like it could go down, in my opinion. After capturing Su, Kuvira deems that since no agreement could be made, that Zaofu is hers to conquer. Korra hears what has happened and disagrees (with Opal and Jinora behind her as a force of air). Now you can read the screenshots. 

Then Korra gets backed up into the military line, where Kuvira probably says some really nasty things to her (notice the hair of Korra and Kuvira is a lot more untidy than in the beginning?) 

 More fighting ensues. Then we know this is near the very end of the fight: 

Korra is pretty much surrounded by the military and has multiple scratches on her arms and face. After being surrounded, it would make sense for Kuvira to deem that she’s not going to let Korra go anywhere. She took Su and Bolin as her prisoners, why wouldn’t she try to take Korra? This could be where the line, “you’re not going anywhere” comes into play. 

That line would be said at the end of the episode, and could possibly be when Jinora, Ikki, Meelo, Opal, Kai (if he’s there) decide to get Korra the heck out of dodge in order to get back to Republic City. That would get us to the place they need to be in, in order for Korra to change back into her water tribe clothes in episode 7. They need reinforcements to defeat Kuvira’s army and help rescue Su and Bolin. And that’s when they’ll possibly learn about the spirit vines. This will be when the Avatar becomes priority target #1.

Oh, Mako.

Where do I even start.  This episode may have broken my heart, but I guess I can understand why the writer’s did what they did.  It says a lot for Mako’s characterization, and even if it makes us shed tears….Mako just wants to be needed.

Bolin has left him, moving out, fighting with him about Varrick because for the first time he’s the one making the money, he’s loved and adored and not in Mako’s shadow.  So, Bolin doesn’t want to hear that Varrick is a bad guy, and I think Mako sees him as his naive little brother, and so that’s why he doesn’t push the matter more than he did.

In regards to Korra, well, it’s been a week and he hasn’t heard from her.  He has no way of knowing that she’s washed up on an island without her memories and meeting the first Avatar.  It’s not like Desna and Eska swung by Republic City to go, “Hey guys, btw, Korra got eaten by a dark spirit.  See ya!”

Mako is stubborn, and he is the type of person that needs to be needed.  He needs to fix people’s problems, and since he can’t fix Korra’s anymore, he’s going to fix Republic City’s.  Because even after the interrogation room scene, he’s still in his uniform.  He’s still doing his job. The same job that lost him the person he loved.

And at first, he probably hoped that Korra would cool down, she’d come back and they’d both be stubborn but finally make up.  But it’s been a week and no one has seen Korra at all.  So, Asami is there, needing to be protected.

And Mako is the guy that needs to be the protector, the savior, the one that can fix the problems.  He can’t do it for his brother anymore, Korra isn’t there, and Republic City doesn’t want to listen to him.

But maybe Asami would, given time.

So, while I dislike the kiss between them, I can understand where it comes from on Mako’s end (who the hell knows why Asami is still pursuing him though).

I feel like this entire scene had really good moments. They were small and unnoticeable if you were paying attention to the whole arc of the episode rather than the small moments. We’ve been doing commentaries all day of the small moments and I really wanted to touch base on this one. We’ve seen so much interaction between these two from their intimate talk before going off to fight, their father-daughter fighting tag team, and then him watching her battle Zaheer. What pains me to think about is how much I think Tonraq thinks he’s let down Korra as well. Whether she’s the Avatar or not, she’s still his child. She’s still his one and only pride and joy. He’s almost lost her on several life-threatening occasions but all those times before have never beat her down so far. And now, I would imagine that he wants to be there for her. It kills me to think about his scene with her when he was trying to wake her up. And when she does, he tells her he’s never going to let her go again. What Tonraq must be thinking is that he’s let her down. And she probably thinks she’s let him down after he’s told her how proud he is.

I love this part because he comes over to her and kneels in front of her, telling her how beautiful she is. We can see that she’s got the bags under her eyes - that she’s suffering from her poisoning, from depressing, or from nightmares. Whatever the case, she is his shining little girl no matter what. And in the frame before this, she doesn’t have that inkling of a smile on her face. But here…she has a smile. They both do. And for a moment, they look at each other and have this incredibly endearing relationship that kills me.

I imagine that when she thinks about home, she thinks about him most especially (not that I don’t give Senna credit as well, I just wish her relationship with Korra was more intimate than what is shown).


i would like to point out several things in this embrace that kills me inside.

  • how they have those open-mouth smiles that shoot me in the face
  • the way his arms are just spread out
  • the fact that it seems like she nearly skids to fall in his arms
  • how their bodies seem to collide in that awkward ‘omfg oops sorry not sorry’ way
  • how his eyes close tightly and he looks like a kitty cat who’s with his favorite kitty companion (and cats are usually independent little thangs)
  • how he’s holding her tightly
  • how she’s all 'woah, what is this. is this a hug’ because her hands are just all flying in the air
  • and then she finally puts her hand on his back
  • and the circle of life is complete

That episode was absolutely incredible for so many reasons? I mean first of all we had the Airbender kids; their grown-up ways, their individual personalities, and their dynamic together. I love each one of them to death.

And then we had Korra. Vibrant, lively, smiling Korra. She’s acting so much like herself again, and it’s amazing to see. The fact that she recovered with Toph-and that Toph made her recover on her own-is inspiring beyond words. She had to fight her bad thoughts, she had to get the poison out of her system. And she did it. And I couldn’t be more proud.

I’m just so happy right now; Book 4 has been brilliant in every way possible and as usual, I cannot wait until the next episode. 

So, I feel completely compelled to talk about this part in the trailer that was released today for Book 3 of TLOK. I will say that I was rendered speechless by how much was shown in the short clip and I was blown away by the mass cardiac arrest I had from waiting so many months for a glimpse into the new season. There are so many fantastic new and ground-breaking elements to the show that I know hardly any show demonstrates, let alone an animated one. Moving to the gist, look at that fucking animation. We all know that TLOK has transitioned from Studio Pierrot to Studio Mir and while I appreciate the effort that SP put in, nothing will hold a candle to Studio Mir’s beautiful and painstakingly done animation frames. Anything is lackluster compared to this. Look at this. LOOK AT THIS. And tell me you don’t feel yourself running upside a building and firebending a woman who uses waterbending as an extension of her body. LITERALLY. And then Mako. Hot damn. I just can’t. The animation is FINESSE.

See this is what I loved about the episode because it brought to light again one of Mako’s critical flaws that he needs to deal with as part of his character development.

So he knows the Red Lotus is after Korra but he largely keeps himself composed because look how confident Korra is. If Korra had shown worry from the get go Mako’s overall reaction would’ve been different. But Korra acts like everything’s under control so Mako thinks in general things are going to be okay and they can handle these guys.

But then Bolin screams in the middle of the night “THEY’VE GOT KORRA” and suddenly any notion that Korra has the situation under control is out the window and Mako goes defcon 1 and just loses his shit (hence the nostalgic “LET HER GO” as he’s haphazardly throwing fire all over the place)

At this point everything is about Korra. Korra Korra Korra. Korra this, Korra that, don’t worry if I’m okay Asami worry that they have Korra, bend the fucking rock at the combustion girl Bolin they’ve got Korra so help me, we need to make sure Korra’s okay shit shit shit.

From here on out Mako is thoroughly rattled. He won’t recover by the end of the episode. He leans over watching Korra get healed. He stands up when everyone sits (which is generally an act of being fidgety due to anxiety). Mako is the only one of the Krew besides Korra who sits in on the interrogations and you can tell he’s so miffed by everyone and their existence. Arms crossed, body language screams defensive position. Sitting/standing across from Korra and immediately following her when they walk into places. Always making sure he has full visual not only on Korra but her surroundings (especially to make sure nothing sneaks up behind her).

Then notice the gusto at which he investigates. Think about how collected Mako was in going after Varrick. The Varrick plot took a few episodes to unfold. Mako kept searching for who was stealing Asami’s shipments and detonating bombs. But it takes awhile. Not this time. Mako’s hyperactive in everything he does. The sense of urgency is so obvious even the other members of the Krew are kind of wondering if he should slow down (second guessing or trying to evaluate their options while Mako’s already bee-lined his entire plan of busting the culprits).

And then they finally corner the guy who’s behind Korra’s attempted kidnapping… and he gets away. Mako throws his fire to no avail and Korra immediately starts working on the metalbending of the wall. Now here comes the interesting point. Mako gets snappy with Korra and Korra snaps right back at him.

Fun fact, Mako’s not upset at Korra in the least bit for her metalbending abilities. Maybe if this was Mako’s first outburst but it’s not, the whole episode is practically an outburst from Mako. Really it’s Mako mad at himself, mad at the situation, and still extremely fearful for Korra. And those feeling surrounding Korra are overwhelming him and it’s more than what he knows how to handle. He’s lashing out because he feels like he’s bound like he has so little control of the situation and hates feeling helpless.

Mako should’ve known. Should’ve been there. Should’ve stopped the criminals. He got away, he shouldn’t have gotten away. Korra was tranquilized and unable to move. The same guys who wanted Korra dead are still out there and still want her dead. Is Korra going to be okay, what are we going to do?

These are Mako’s thoughts. His mind is a chaotic mess. Asami’s partially right… he’s not in touch with his feelings. But that’s not the overlooking problem. The elephant in the room is Mako doesn’t know how to deal with his feelings.

Especially when it comes to Korra.

See this is one of Mako’s flaws that’s been perpetrated throughout the series and has been really focused on this season. Mako doesn’t know how to cope with his feelings regarding Korra. They’re wild and out of control. Bolin? That’s his brother, they grew up on the streets together. Mako loves Bolin but they have a brother-brother relationship and Mako’s used to Bolin getting into sticky situations so he has practice keeping his cool together. Asami? There were past feelings but Asami is a safe person. This could divulge into a whole side conversation about Mako’s relation to Asami and how it was a cool burn and she’s a safe option but not a deep wild love kind of option and that’s why the relationship is so different but getting back to the point.

Korra. Korra gets under Mako’s skin. She creates feelings in him that even he doesn’t fully understand. And it drives him insane. Hell, he’s admitted it. She drives him wild and the love he has for her is so deep and passionate that it really rips him out of his comfort zone. His feelings aren’t safe and controlled. Which means when something happens to Korra it drives him up a wall in a way that it wouldn’t if it were literally anyone else. And that lack of control is not only something Mako doesn’t know how to deal with but I’d vouch that it makes him feel uncomfortable.

He’s the cool under fire guy. The hat trick guy. The guy who always comes up with a silent, quick, emotionless solution for every problem under the sun. Mako feels like he should be able to keep calm in any situation. But when it comes to Korra he can’t and he doesn’t yet know how to handle it.

But he needs to. It’s literally the only way Mako and Korra are going to get back together. Mako has to reconcile his feelings for Korra and recognize that it’s okay to feel that way about Korra and rather than bottling it up and having it eat him alive he needs to learn to show those feelings to Korra.

And it’s going to happen. I can feel it. The episode is coming where the tension can’t be ignored anymore and it’s going to have to be dealt with 


Can we just talk about how Opal is able to bring Toph’s guard down?

Lin greets her, obviously shocked, and Toph just returns the greeting, unsmiling. But when Opal runs over and hugs her, she doesn’t recoil (and she made it clear with Korra that she hates hugs). Toph smiles and even affectionately comments how Opal was only up to her waist the last time they saw each other.

This reminds me of how Opal was the first person (even quicker than her own mother) who was able to get through to Lin when she first arrived in Zaofu. Since Lin and Toph have similar personalities (Toph is a more miserable version of Lin, according to Korra), it’s interesting how they both have a soft spot for Opal. Maybe it’s because they know that despite her being so sweet and loving, she’s as stubborn and strong-willed as both her aunt and grandmother. Basically a true Beifong who’s more in touch with her feelings and unafraid to show them, and Toph and Lin both admire her for that.

“Change” was not perfect. As much as I loved Asami and Korra’s friendship, I’m still not sure what it is that binds them together—largely due to the conspicuous, if well-coiffed void that is Asami’s personality. She’s nice, and friendly, and pretty, and rich, and that’s about it.

This speaks to my larger problem with Korra, and the thing I miss most about the original series: the lack of filler. Back in the days, fans spent a lot of time complaining about Avatar episodes like “Bitter Work” and “Nightmares and Daydreams,” wherein the show indulged in plot-adjacent stories like “Zuko tries lightningbending” and “Aang can’t sleep.” And yeah, some of them were ridiculous. But their presence—enabled by longer seasons and a series-spanning story arc Korra does not have—let the characters settle into themselves more and make connections that, while not strictly plot-important, gave the story an emotional fullness that Korra sometimes lacks.

In Avatar, Sokka had time to confide in Toph that he could no longer remember what his mother looked like. The show could devote 22 minutes to the villainous Fire Nation kids’ spring break antics. Sometimes we had to endure eye-rollers like “The Great Divide,” sure, but sometimes we got “The Tales of Ba Sing Se.”

Korra is able to maintain a certain tension and energy that Avatar could not—but sometimes, I think the cost was too high. Korra’s cast is multifaceted, but the show can never play around with character pairings or structure. It will never have an equivalent to “Little Soldier Boy,” or even the finale’s duel between Zuko and Azula, which, though largely wordless, brought two seasons’ worth of development to a resonant end. This season was sharp and twisty and I yelled at the screen a lot, but really? I want to know more about how Mako feels when he confronts homeless kids and sees himself in their faces. I want to see Asami visit her father in jail. I want to meet Zuko’s daughter. I want to love these characters, but the show makes it difficult.

I hope Korra is able to slow down next season for these reasons. I doubt it will, but I hope, because I think that taking some time to mess around with its already vibrant cast would take it from great to classic.

—  Juliet Kahn saying it as it is

I’m actually quite pleased with the way Bolin’s plot is going this season. Even though I’d like him to be with the rest of the Krew, I think him being out on his own (not counting Varrick) is the best thing. We get to see him for more than just “the funny guy” or “Mako’s little brother”.

I really liked Bolin’s scenes in the “Reunion” episode, as I think he especially shines in the above scenes/gifs (and the episode in general). I saw Bolin not just another member of Team Avatar. 


so, it’s commentary time. and i’ll keep this brief because i’m sure that other people will add to this as time goes on. CAN I JUST GET A WRETCHED SOUND AT THE WAY KORRA LOOKS? this is right after everyone is telling her that they’ll miss her. understandable that everyone wants korra to recuperate and get back on her feet and being at home is going to make that recovery process faster (or so everyone thinks). and this goes back to what everyone has said about the world being able to keep its balance without the avatar. korra’s face just makes me do the ugly crying face because it’s what’s happening. things are being kept in the balance while she’s gone. i know that no one means that she isn’t needed, but how the hell can she think about anything else? she’s gone through amon, unalaq, vaatu, and zaheer in a matter of months, right? and then everyone’s all BON VOYAGE, BABE! with sweet sentiments of course. and you see korra wave with a smile because she wants the last thing they see to be her smile and her looking somewhat happy at going home with her parents. but she’s leaving behind her second home - her friends, her role in republic city.

and i just want to punch myself in the face because it would hurt less than seeing korra this way.

p.s. i’m sure this leads to her swiping off that hair like HONOR.

I’m surprised that I haven’t seen anyone talk about the scene between Mako and Korra in regards to watching Mako. Granted, I’m not on the dash too much, but gah. LOOK AT THAT FACE.

I know that Mako is notorious for receiving a lot of negativity in the Avatar fandom which makes me sad. I know that both sides have validity to their opinions, but it just makes me sad in general. Call me a hopeless romantic and a simple fangirl, but I do love Mako’s extremely flawed character development. He’s very real to me regardless of what I read on Tumblr. Now, actually moving onto this picture. LOOK AT THAT FACE. Please look at it and tell me you don’t feel sorry for him.

I know that Korra’s got some adversity coming to her and she really does have to face it, but all the other characters have got their tribulations. Mako has to deal with being a “man of the law” and supporting Korra’s decisions. You know that he loves Korra and there’s been a lot of friction between the two of them. They didn’t start out on the right foot, but they managed to push their differences aside and fall in love with one another. As Janet Varney said in a recent interview, they’re a high-powered couple. More so, they’re a short-tempered couple as well. Mako has tried his best to not let his opinion or decisions get in the way of Korra’s decisions. I’m sure that she was frustrated that he wouldn’t give her an opinion in the first episode of what she should do and now he’s caused a rift by revealing her decisions.

Mako’s face makes me really sad because he keeps looking back and forth between Korra and averting his gaze. What’s more saddening is that he’s clearly upset and stressed beyond belief. He’s found a calling that allows him to be the complete opposite of what he used to be when he was younger. He’s a man of the law as President Raiko has put it and that President is the cause of his troubles. We can tell that he’s up to no good. You can tell by the way he manipulated Mako into stopping him at that very last second. He played on Mako’s good intentions and his commitment to his post. And it obviously sucks that he had to hurt Korra in the process of following the law.

Now what is disheartening is the look of his eyes. His eyebrows are furrowed. His gaze is averted. And he has lines and bags under his eyes. No doubt from guilt, pain, and stress. He just ratted out his girlfriend to the President - the one person that has stopped Korra from trying to save her family and her people. That stings. And I do feel sorry for Mako because he was put in a painful, compromising position. You know what else? I think he’s been awake a lot, trying to figure out the truth behind the attack. It’s obvious that there’s some FUNNY business going on and like a true officer, he’s trying to figure out the truth. It’s just so hard that he had to involve Korra.

And akin to Korra’s crying on the speedboat, I think he feels the same anguish.