the vampire diaries 5x04

anonymous asked:

For God sake Elena didn't lose anything with Damon . She was happy with Damon . Damon helped her in every way even Stefan said so . Elena never really loved Stefan she didn't even knew him properly she fell madly in love with Damon . You wanna ship se do but don't say Elena was puppet in de relationship . Stefan was just the chapter in her life the same way Elena was the chapter in Stefan life .

And if you want to ship DE then go ahead but stop being so willfully ignorant about your ship, anon.

I have multiple posts about the inflation of DE:

http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/149414909030/it-was-stefans-love-who-healed-her-broken-heart

http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/149396624855/love-isnt-a-choice-if-it-were-elena-would-have

http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/154739617890/it-really-bugs-me-when-people-complain-about

http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/139498020585/what-about-stelena-makes-them-superior-to-delena

http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/156101914470/delena-is-about-acceptance-learning-and-growing

But you guys seem adamant on making me repeat myself.

“Elena never really loved Stefan”

Where is the proof of this? I mean next to the fact that she consistently declares her love for Stefan

These declarations of love are earned by how ride or die Elena was for Stefan.

Like you don’t face werewolves and go into vervain/snake-filled wells and run into a house full of tomb vampires and risk coming face to face with the supernatural monster trying to kill you if you don’t “really” love someone. This type of devotion is not bred from obligation, anon.

she didn’t even knew him properly

Elena knew Stefan so implicitly that she knew he was on the other line when he didn’t even say anything:

Elena’s emotional and spiritual knowledge of Stefan (which I speak about here: http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/158674534265/can-you-show-examples-of-stelena-knowing-each) is unparalleled and that knowledge and that connection actually, and not DE-actually, but actually actually made Stefan a better person: 

We started this season with Stefan drinking Elena’s blood. Is that going to come back to haunt him or haunt them as he drinks more human blood?
Julie Plec: Not at the moment. I think that in its own way, it was a smart choice. He’s come to terms with all his demons from last year and all the guilt that lead him down that road and Stefan’s issues with blood were psychological and emotional. And drinking small tiny amounts every day with the trust and the commitment of your one true love to build up the strength so that you never have to worry about becoming that guy, I think we want to see if we can deliver on that. (source)

And this declaration to Rebekah (and Julie’s quote about Stefan) is earned in action and not simply dialogue. It’s earned in action because pretty much whenever Elena came face to face with Stefan’s demons, his lust for blood, his voracious vampirism, her presence, her emotional knowledge of Stefan would make it subside. It begins in 1x10 because she’s actually seeing past his vampirism, embracing it and accepting it, seeing to the man:

which allows for this to happen:

and that type of connection doesn’t go away because in 5x04 it’s repeated:

And in 5x06 it’s reiterated how much Elena brings Stefan back to life:

And in 6x16, Elena is directly related, yet again, to bringing Stefan back to his humanity, narratively, she is directly related to him being the best version of himself:

she fell madly in love with Damon 

I guess we’re ignoring the fact that Elena literally had to die and then be emotionally entrapped by a bond that gives her the illusion of free will to make DE happen. I talk about that here: http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/156287220175/i-really-liked-your-toxic-relationship-post-but but the highlights are these:

“The bottom line is that Elena as a human made a very, very, very clear choice that she would love Stefan always and forever,” she says. “But then her entire life turned upside down, and any feelings she originally had for Damon were still there, and of course magnified. There was always going to be a little bit of a confusion there for her — but not enough confusion for her to be over Stefan. It would take a lot to rip Elena away from loving Stefan. It would take years and seasons. We’d be eighty, if we followed the natural progression of that relationship.”

Damon helped her in every way even Stefan said so

H O W?

I have asked this many times and no DEr has been able to give me a legitimate answer, all you guys give me is what you think happened, it’s conjecture based on unearned dialogue. I want to know what he’s actually done that has propelled Elena’s character development because from what I recall, it’s Stefan who’s the one who always helps her:

but don’t say Elena was puppet in de relationship

Except that she is though. Because the DE relationship is inherently Damon-focused, Elena is his plot line so she actually just has to be there, it’s not about the both of them unlike SE:

Julie Plec: I can only say that it’s a show predicated on a girl coming back to life and her development of love for one brother who then, because of who she is, changes the life of the other brother and that’s our show […] (source)

Even the 6x22 goodbye scene is inherently about Damon:

“ It’s our way of the characters having sex in like a beautiful way, so it made perfect sense on the road, which is symbolic of Damon’s journey as a vampire[…]”

as opposed to the SE goodbye which is inherently about Elena and their knowledge of each other:

“That’s where she admitted she never wanted to lose her humanity, she didn’t want to be a vampire, and so he found it fitting for them to revisit that environment,” Dries said.

The sire bond … Elena isn’t given any complicated feelings about the fact that she’s emotionally enslaved to someone else, all she has to do is believe that she loves him:

I think the takeaway, ultimately, is that Elena believes it so fundamentally that in that moment, it’s enough for Damon to let himself believe too.

and it’s Damon who gets the “character” exploration of struggling with something and letting himself believe it’s real or not real, they make it inherently about how Damon feels when it’s Elena that this is happening to:

And it’s gonna continue to eat at Damon for the next few episodes […] Just letting himself allow it to be real for one small moment is enough for Damon.

At least with Stefan and Elena, she’s allowed to have complicated feelings which actually enrich their relationship because she goes through a multitude of emotions:

Plec assures that this storyline will be a big deal for the Stefan/Elena relationship, especially as Elena struggles “with her desire to help rescue this person that she loved very purely and very deeply, but also learning the lesson that you can’t necessarily let yourself be consumed in your life by saving someone else’s.”

Even their first meeting is solely for the benefit of Damon:

It was us wanting to give Damon something to fight for. Ric is unbeatable, a jillion times stronger than Damon. Damon was a dead man, and Ric was relishing beating him, and Damon had nothing left to live for, having been passed over once again. It was just that slight little thing that she said to him, when she was just trying to take the sting off: “Hey, maybe if you and I had met first.” She was just trying to soften the blow. But in reality, he had this memory that gave him the will to fight back. I love that moment, where Ric’s about to drive the stake into him, and he’s like “You know what? I’m not ready to die today.”

And with SE, it’s about how they save each other:

Julie Plec: In my mind, Elena’s parents are dead. It was a human accident, and a human tragedy, and as we know, the night that Stefan pulled her out of the water and saved her life. That was kind of the beginning of their love story. (source)

She isn’t just this symbol to be reacted to.

Even when Nina talks about SE, it’s about the individualism of Elena in relation to the love of SE:

Nina: But Elena — it’s not about that for her. She cares about Stefan. And he’s important to her and she has this connection with him, but she will put her friends and her family and the safety of her town before anything else, and she’s not going to swoon over the fact that he’s a vampire and ask her to bite him right away and all that. (source)

and you see that in their relationship. She doesn’t realize she can be with Stefan until after he saves Bonnie’s life in 1x09, she doesn’t get back with Stefan in season 2 until after he sacrifices his freedom to get with Jeremy out of the tomb, they take care of the people around them together, whether it’s saving Matt or taking care of Caroline after being tortured or helping Bonnie when it comes to Emily, where is any of that with Damon? They can’t even meet Bonnie halfway in the Prison World because they’re too busy arguing about their relationship. She doesn’t know what’s going on with Jeremy because she’s too caught up sleeping with Damon, she isn’t even paying attention to the parent-teacher interviews, she doesn’t care that he killed Aaron and kidnapped Jeremy again and the show doesn’t actually explore the psychological battle of loving someone who does these terrible things, she makes one comment about bending her morals and that’s it, that fundamentally reduces her character.

In season 8, the show very rarely (if ever) talks about Elena as an individual person or about her significance to the other characters, it’s all about how if Elena was there then Damon wouldn’t go off the rails, if Elena was there she would be able to get through to Damon, I wish Elena was here so Damon wouldn’t be the way he is, there are like four times in the season when Elena is spoken about outside the context of what she can do for Damon. When Elena wakes up, she realizes that Stefan is gone and she and Bonnie briefly share in that grief and then instead of asking about Bonnie, it’s “where is he?” 

It’s only when Damon is gone that Elena actually is the person she’s supposed to be because the show gives her other focuses like bringing Stefan back or bringing Bonnie back to life or setting Caroline up or getting everyone together to do shots so they can hang out, when Damon is back in the picture, the show just shackles her to him.

Stefan was just the chapter in her life the same way Elena was the chapter in Stefan life .

Except not? Their connection exists throughout the series and it’s proven repeatedly that they depend on each other and are tied to each other more than they’re tied to other people. Like Elena could break compulsion for Stefan but she couldn’t do the same for Damon.

In season 8, Bonnie tells Stefan to find his hope and what he does right after is write to Elena:

In the finale Elena is found sitting at the Salvatore crypt, writing about how she owes her life to Stefan:

[and I talk about how this is different than Matt here: http://zalrb.tumblr.com/post/158520624145/elena-wrote-in-her-journal-that-she-owed-her-epic]

In season 7, Caroline talks about how she’s been waiting for the day Stefan could love her the way he loved Elena

Not to mention the natural intimacy of SE and the romantic undertones of their scenes:

Like their narrative, their action, seeps through everything, DE has the dialogue, we have what actually matters.

anonymous asked:

Like as in Stefan and Elena realizing they still had feelings and like they got back together

Ah ok. Well the funny thing is, I think it’s a journey that starts from 4x07 onward, these moments either verbal or nonverbal, where one of them or both of them recognize the romantic undercurrent of their situation but don’t do anything about it because the larger circumstances are fucked up and confusing:

This isn’t just Elena thanking Stefan for stopping Jeremy and getting that shard of glass out of her neck, this is intimate, she’s rubbing his hand with hers, parting her lips, staring at him intensely, that sense of safety and relief of Stefan comforting her is clearly still there, like she’s good now.

In 4x10, it’s interesting because it’s an episode dedicated to tearing SE down brick by brick but when Elena and Stefan are alone, he asks her “You’re sorry that you slept with him or you’re sorry that I found out?” and she responds with:

There’s a sense of regret there, it’s subtle, but “I’m sorry about all of it”? It could’ve just been “I’m sorry that I hurt you” and she follows him down the hall:

This isn’t Elena just being a compassionate person because she didn’t do this with Matt when Stefan came to town and Matt was upfront and almost heartbreakingly honest about his jealousy and his desire to win her back. She legitimately just stares at him. There’s a desperation to Elena in 4x10 that indicates feelings despite her sirebonded “When he looks at me all he sees is a broken toy”

And 4x11, I believe that in that moment Stefan was over it and he was exhausted and he was done:

but Elena so clearly wasn’t:

And that sense of loss and heartbreak is quiet but it’s there and Elena’s visibly experiencing it but again nothing is being done.

In 4x12 when Damon outs Stefan sleeping with Rebekah, I think it’s a moment where both of them realize an attachment is still there because they share a glance:

and I think it’s a time when they both realize there’s a tether because Stefan has no reason to be embarrassed or to feel like he’s betrayed Elena but the fact that he does suggests that he knows Elena would be hurt, which is different than Elena feeling a type of way like when Damon slept with Rebekah:

and everyone knows Elena’s hurt, like her facial expression is hurt for a while too:

It’s reminiscent of this Derena quote when Serena finds out Dan may sleep with someone else:

4x16 when Elena has no humanity, she’s not supposed to care about anything and yet:

and Stefan asks her specifically if she’s jealous in a tone that indicates he knows that she is:

like they know:

and it’s different than how she interacts with Damon because with Stefan, she’s honest about what she feels without any sort of emotional attachment to it:

but with Damon, she handles him and tells him what he wants to hear and manipulates him without the guilt that she had when she manipulated him with humanity:

And that’s an important distinction because an attachment and a connection and a romance is still there with SE which Elena and Stefan recognize but they’re in no position to do anything about it, which happens again in 4x19:

4x22 was another episode that was supposed to usher Stefan on to moving on because Lexi tells him to take a hint when Elena punches him except Elena’s freaking out over Stefan possibly having feelings for Katherine:

like she’s in this chaotic mindset, saying that Katherine needs to die, she doesn’t believe Bonnie is linked to her and then she just randomly accuses Stefan of having feelings for Katherine? That’s indicative of a subconscious fear.

Then we move on to season 5 and Stefan is sort of everywhere for Elena because she’s been thinking about him and worried about him:

and Stefan is dreaming about Elena to pull him through:

OK, people want to chalk that up to Elena simply feeling bad and Stefan holding onto something that isn’t there anymore, but then in 5x02:

Her anger about Stefan being in pain is such a powerful trigger it almost causes her to kill a whole bunch of people and then there’s this moment when she’s yelling at Damon:

That is a breakthrough, this is clearly indicative of what she feels with regards to Stefan and with regards to Damon and the fact that Stefan is what causes such a compulsion but also what breaks her out of it?

While Stefan is still dreaming about Elena to get him through the suffering:

simultaneously but individually realizing that a connection still exists, a strong one, a romantic one, one that they ignore because Stefan is drowning and Elena just got with Damon.

In 5x03

obviously the fact that Elena rushes to Stefan and doesn’t even notice Damon is indicative of a lot:

but it’s not until they get back to the mansion where I feel like a realization is being, well, realized, like what happened in the cabin is instinct but now that Stefan is safe, the way she watches him:

and how she puts on his ring:

That’s knowing. Even the way she says “We missed you” and I just realized Damon watches her as she speaks:

In 5x04, I mean it’s pretty self-explanatory, this is just Stefan and Elena hanging out and they’re vibing and they’re laughing and that pull is still there and Elena has to stop herself from giving into it and even without memories Stefan is feeling it, that is a huge marker of them realizing that something is still there but not doing anything about it:

and she’s legit confused:

And in 5x06 when she finds out he’s at Tessa’s, she loses her mind:

and rants to Damon about Stefan being over there and then goes over there:

whereas Stefan can’t not be there for her even when he’s mad at her:

Then 5x11 there’s that flare-up again:

and again they both know:

but they both actively put Damon before themselves, like Stefan talks about how in the past Elena never gave up on him and is asking her to extend that courtesy to Damon because he knows she isn’t, that instinct isn’t there, they both know that.

In 5x16 when Stefan tells Elena about Katherine’s plan to win him back, there is so much unsaid, so much in their stares and it’s not Elena’s *shrug stare:

this is a weighted stare, so there’s knowing happening here and then Stefan leaves and Elena lets him:

And then the infamous 5x18 episode, this is the episode I think that they’re both aware that they know their connection exists:

And they lament the ending of their fantasy human life together in a way that’s full of such longing:

and when Stefan talks about their relationship in real life, despite the fact that a lot of the things he said happened didn’t happen like growing apart, they were ripped away from each other because of a stupid sire bond but despite all of that, there isn’t a sense of distance there, I get a sense of regret and sadness, like when Elena says “I died”  as a part of their journey and what they went through, she died and got sired and chose Damon and her tone is very sombre when she says it:

and it’s as if they declare they’ll always love each other as a way to make up for the fact that they aren’t together:

and there is such an emotional safety and intimacy that Elena can rest her head on Stefan’s shoulder:

and this ridiculous line:

honestly boils down to “Do you think Damon and I will ever be this close?” “No.” And I think this is when they actively albeit nonverbally decide to just stay not doing anything. I think they were already on a path back towards each other from 4x07 but this could’ve been the turning point/defining moment/suddenly I see moment, which I think it was, they just chose not to do anything about it, but this could’ve been when they did or begun to because then you have this:

just moments of them being friendly and yet not so that when Stefan dies in 5x21 that could catapult Elena giving into her realizations throughout two seasons.

and then in 6x04, they’re having so much fun together and Stefan’s vows mostly can be related to their relationship:

and there are sort of quiet moments of realization:

The 6x08 phone call:

and then a moment for them to ponder about what’s being said, now considering that Stefan goes to Caroline after this and Elena goes to Damon after this an argument could be made that they both realize they want to love their respective love interests in this manner and perhaps they do, want to but I think this moment is indicative of them loving each other this way, I mean even in this phone call they’re both being honest with each other and telling each other everything, which they can’t do with the people around them,but instead of acknowledging that, they’re trying to gun for the next best thing because they’re both involved with other people sort of.

Then you have 6x11 and the ring

I think this would be a turning point episode for me because everything is still at the surface, it’s always there and every time something threatens it like this moment or another woman or Stefan hating her, Elena loses it and I would have her realize that because of what happened in the season before and even in the episodes before including things like this:

or we could take this moment and move on and tie it with other moments:

Stefan is just always on her mind even when she doesn’t fully realize it and then 6x16 could be another turning point:

and I think 6x22 is another 5x18, a recognition of how much they still love each other, a recognition of that romance but an active disregard or burial of it, I would also make that more apparent:

and then seasons 7 and 8 are just Stefan re-realizing these things in subtle but consistent ways:

So when 8x16 comes around and we’ve got these moments from season 4 until now, 8x16 is yet another 5x18 moment first non-verbally:

and then verbally when she writes about Stefan

So I would just make it more apparent.

Legit sitting here like ...

… how the hell is SE fan service though? Like do people not understand that things are meant to continue from previous seasons?

In season 4 before the sire bond this was SE:

This is the episode she sleeps with Damon (4x07):

and then in 4x10:

4x11:

4x12, when she finds out that he and Rebekah slept together:

4x13:

4x16

4x19

4x21

4x23

So, what, in season 5 that connection, that love, that angst is supposed to disappear because of a sirebonded love in which the summation of the DE relationship is: a tawdry blood-sharing scene that Damon manipulated Elena into performing, a tawdry dance at a frat party while they’re high on blood, first sex then morning sex then talking about how things would be so much more fun if they were having sex plus a couple of hugs and Damon pushing her off Wickery bridge to save her, him turning off her humanity which then sets other destructive situations in motion? Like really? They actually don’t do much in season 4.

It makes sense that in 5x01-5x02 Stefan would dream of Elena when it’s been iterated and reiterated that she’s a direct link to his humanity:

And Elena’s frenzy about his whereabouts:

keeps in line with their relationship:

and the fact that she broke compulsion for Stefan

keeps in line with how entwined they’re supposed to be and that Stefan can calm her through an emotional storm:

Her being focused on Stefan and not on Damon:

(love that gif btw)

keeps in line:

Her relief at getting Stefan back:

keeps in line:

and Elena nearly kissing Stefan in 5x04:

with all of the history and intimacy and chemistry they have not to mention how that chemistry and intimacy is rushing to the forefront because they’re just being together:

because it never went away, like that vibing is still present.

And Elena being jealous

keeps in line with Elena being jealous over Caroline and Rebekah and Katherine in season 4:

and season 2:

and Elena wondering if she and Damon will ever be able to talk like her and Stefan:

keeps in line with the fact that Stefan knows who Elena is and she can’t talk to anyone the way she can talk to him especially not Damon:

So legit where is the fan service though?