Man, I haven’t seen a Spider-Man movie so good for a very long time. I disliked Garfield’s version and I wasn’t really expecting much from Tom Holland, but after Civil War, my hope actually did skyrocket. And Spider-Man: Homecoming has not disappointed me. Though, it had one small minus.
Spoilers ahead, obviously.
Here’s my list of things I totally loved:
Bear papa Tony Stark. Seriously. A++++ character development. Tony is nothing but a sweet angel, I promise. He doesn’t steal the show either.
HAPPY HOGAN HONESTLY I WAS SO HAPPY TO SEE YOU!!!!!
They chose not to follow the boring-to-death Mary Jane/Gwen Stacy bullshit, instead they chose a NORMAL high school-like hardcore crushing/relationship. Not the big, eternal love at the age of 15. Yes, Peter was clearly having strong feelings for Liz, but it wasn’t all unnecessarily too much. They kept it totally natural and realistic. I will love them forever for that.
Biracial relationship, biracial marriage. Nice.
Many POC characters.
Ned is basically me the entire movie, honestly
Did I mention they kept it all REAL? Peter cried more than once, because he was in danger, because he was confused, because he is still a kid. Yes, he is tough, he is smart, he is strong and brave, but he is also only 15 and he is allowed to be weak and to learn out of that. I think it was really, really awesome.
Zero plot holes. Like, literally, none. They packed it all up nicely, addressed issues from CA:CW and Avengers both 1 and 2. I wish all the other movies and TV-show makers would do the same with their stories.
Karen, the suit lady and her instant-kill mode. Yup.
The Bank of Queen’s scene, with criminals wearing Avengers’ masks, so a casual viewier would get the “they’re seen as cirminals now” vibe. Small thing, done mostly for fun, but I like it anyways.
PAPA BEAR TONY STARK SERIOUSLY I WILL NOT SHUT UP ABOUT IT
Also, Happy mentioned the plain contained “materials for Cap’s newshield”. I think I had an orgasm just by hearing that.
Oh and about Cap: I can’t even imagine the amount of fun Chris Evans had by jumping into his old Captain America costume just to film those lame educational movie clips
Also, the amount of trolling in the post-credit scene is strong. Very strong.
Assholes. Seriously. And Chris Evans’ shit-eating grin when Cap said “patience” was the worst. Fuck you, sir.
Things I did not like:
- Peppers Potts. What the even fuck. Like why? Where did she pop out from? Seriously? Just ????????
Ok guys, I feel like I need to clarify what I meant with Pepper.
It’s not that I don’t like Pepperony, or Pepper Potts herself. I freaking love Pepper Potts
(as an individual character and not a part of Pepperony ship) and if
Tony can’t be with Steve, then Pepper is honestly the best choice for
him. (reason I’m saying Steve would be better is because Steve is much
more understanding and delicate when it comes to Tony and that’s
something Tony desperately needs)(but Stony can happen only if Stucky
cannot tho. Stucky #1, always).
Anyway, all I’m saying is
just that she popped out of the blue and it looked like nothing
happened? Judging by Tony’s face in CA:CW when he said Pepper “needed a
break”, it looked like she dumped him permanently, because she disliked
his lifestyle and/or was too stressed herself (and that’s totally
understandable, tho). It was probably the big drama effect that was
meant to contribute to Tony’s general stress, frustration, and the
feeling of not being in control of his life (again). I get it now after
watching Spider-Man, it actually makes sense.
I just don’t
like the way they put Pepper back in the story. Like nothing happened,
like Tony was never heartbroken, and they’ve been happily together since
2008. Even though I love to see Tony happy and and head over heels in love,
I wish they would save it to the Avengers movie and explain what
actually happened between them and how did they resolve the conflict.
Potts is a strong and smart woman, she’s definitely the Stark Industry
boss material, and of course she is a human being that’s constantly put
into stressful situations thanks to Tony and his identity as Iron Man. I
am not saying that she should block her own feelings just to make Tony
happier, but if his lifestyle is too stressful for her and she cannot
accept it, maybe it would be better if they weren’t together. Not
because they’re not in love, but because Tonyneeds someone who will stay with him no matter what. He
needs this psychological and emotional stability, and I don’t think it
does him any good if Pepper constantly changes her mind whether to be or
not to be with him. Either she stays and accepts him, and Tony of
course does everything to soothe her stress, or they split. I just don’t
like the emotional roller coaster Tony is constantly put through: he
deserves cuddles, soft kisses and patience. Pepper deserves
psychological stability, too.
That’s why I disliked the way
they put them back together: I simply cannot know how they resolved the
conflict. I miss it, because I wanted to see if they’re actually doing
it properly this time. If they did, then I’m totally happy for Pepper’s
For Spiderman 2, the main villain is the Green Goblin. At the same time, the MCU introduces Gwen Stacy in order to kickstart a love triangle between Peter, Michelle/MJ, and Gwen. I know, I know, please hold your groans since that isn’t the crazy idea.
For most of the movie, Peter, Ned, MJ, Aunt May, Gwen, and a redeemed Flash (Team Spiderman) are trying to find out the identity of the Green Goblin. The climactic plot twist is that Norman Osborn (the main suspect for the Green Goblin) is revealed to be a red herring. Norman isn’t the Goblin. That’s when Ned and MJ find out that it’s Gwen!
Turns out, MCU Gwen Stacy’s full name is revealed to be “Gwen Harriet Stacy-Osborn”. She’s an amalgamation of Gwen Stacy and Harry Osborn. For reasons I won’t get into, Gwen is the illegitimate daughter of Norman and wants vengeance on her father. In order to do this, she uses OsCorp technology to ruin his name.
The final battle is a subversion of the infamous Gwen Stacy death scene. She is knocked off her glider by Peter and falls to her death. Peter tries catching her with his web but she gets whiplash from the sudden stop.
The mid-credits scene is Norman forming the Sinister Six in order to avenge his daughter’s death. Vulture is the first recruit.
The post-credits scene is OsCorp recovering Gwen’s body, hinting at her resurrection.
i will never understand why the “anti-marriage” people say that peter and MJ’s marriage is unrealistic.
their main reasoning is that MJ is supposedly too attractive for peter (even though the man himself is also canonically attractive?) and that’s just thinly veiled sexism. also doesn’t speak to how highly you think of your supposed favourite character either.
how is it unrealistic that MJ, who was one of the first people to find out peter was spider-man when she was 16 (therefore knowing and understanding one of the most important aspects of his life), who endured the death of gwen stacy alongside peter, the incident making them both grow up, and both grow together, becoming close, having to go through it, but knowing they had each other to get through it. how is it unrealistic that after everything they have gone through, they fall in love and want to spend their lives together?
cause MJ is hot? k…
while MJ struggled with peter being spider-man, she was the only significant other of peter’s to ever understand that peter is spider-man. spider-man is peter. they are one, and that you can’t have one without the other. you have gwen who hated spider-man, felicia who only wanted spider-man, and other relationships in between that amount to nothing. in the end, peter and MJ share a bond together that neither of them will find with anybody else.
another excuse is that they don’t like peter with MJ, because they like peter being unlucky and always losing at life. and to me, that’s just very, very sad. sure the ‘parker luck’ likes to put peter through hell, but what kind of bleak and depressing message do you think spider-man (the EPITOME of HOPE, and that you can still get up and fight after being beaten down) is sending, if he had to go through all the shitty trials of life by himself. without his rock by his side. without getting through it together. without have ONE big final win to make all the loses worth it?
look, if you don’t like the marriage, that’s okay. that’s your opinion. but don’t try to chalk it up to it being unrealistic of out of character, cause that’s so untrue.
hey broegan :) can you tell me about mj? i feel like i don't know much about her! what's she like? why is she your favourite?
oh gosh i don’t even know where to begin.
mary jane watson is such a lovely character. she’s intricate and complex and great. she started off as this party girl and you just think she’s shallow and doesn’t really care about anything but herself.
then it turns out she actually has an extremely abusive home life/father, so she puts on this party girl facade to hide from that. she doesn’t want to let anybody in, she just wants to have fun to forget about it. (after the death of gwen stacy, it changed her and peter a lot, and they both grew up).
she wants to be a star in any possible way. she has huge hopes n dreams and is determined and confident.
she is a huge feminist (which is pretty big back in the 60s).
she is honestly the most supportive girlfriend in the entire world.
and she is incredibly bad ass and has saved peter’s ass countless times and isn’t the damsel everyone for some reason thinks she is?
and this video perfectly sums up not only her being the best love interest for peter parker, but for them being the best love story in comics, period.
What do you dislike about league of extraordinary gentlemen?
Short answer: What I dislike about the comic is the same thing comic fans disliked about the movie- it turned my favorite characters into caricatures.
Make up your mind, Alan Moore- is the League okay with rape or not? It’s horrifying when Hyde or Bond do it, but they first come across the Invisible Man in the process of raping children and basically laugh it off.
Bull-freaking-shit would Jonathan dump Mina over having ugly scars. If you really needed to get him out of the way to hook Mina up with your preferred guy, why not just kill him off and have Mina angst over his death Gwen Stacy-style?
If Jonathan did ever dump Mina for her scars, Van Helsing would be waiting outside the house with a baseball bat (for Jonathan’s kneecaps) and a bouquet of flowers (in case Mina wanted to trade up.)
Why did Mina fall in love with Alan Quartermain? I’m not opposed to younger woman/older man pairings, but…why? Some amount of looks can be traded for some amount of personality or vice versa, but Quartermain as written by Moore had neither.
Why did Moore’s idea of “strong female character” mean “take a woman who was canonically kind and make her a straw feminist ice queen”?
If Jekyll became Hyde because he was ashamed of being gay, then why the everloving hell was Hyde into women?
People Alan Moore cannot do pastiches of: Shakespeare, P.G. Woodehouse, Jack Kerouac.
Pirate Jenny canonically (insofar as a throwaway song is canon) became murderous over doing humiliating menial work. This was not enough for Alan Moore- she had to be raped, because that’s the only possible reason a woman would become a supervillain.
Since he’d already made her Indian, if he wanted her to have additional motivation to be mad, couldn’t it have been about racism?
I don’t like what he did with James Bond, but defending James Bond really isn’t the hill I want to die on. Suffice it to say that it felt mean-spirited.
Speaking of mean-spirited, what does Alan Moore have against Harry Potter and Peter Rabbit?
If you’re going to write a series of comics that amount to “look how much better I am than these other sexist, racist authors!” then your comic should be 1) actually better, and 2) not sexist or racist.
Neil Gaiman goes on about how the movie adaptation was the first time everyone agreed the movie sucked and the comic was great, and it annoys me because I *don’t* agree that the comic was great.
In fact, that’s a big part of why it all pisses me off- I feel like I’m supposed to love this comic. I spent years trying to love this comic. I do not love this comic.
Now, do I think you can do this kind of critique well? Yes, and I’ll point to a series I love, Jane Carver of Waar. An expy of John Carter of Mars shows up in the second book as the villain, and poorly handled it could have felt like a snide “fuck you to all my predecessors in this genre.” As written, though, it was “isn’t it fucked up that John Carter of Mars owned slaves and fought for the Confederacy?” This works because it is a valid point. It is fucked up that John Carter of Mars owned slaves and fought for the Confederacy.
League, on the other hand, is like going “It’s it fucked up that John Carter of Mars ate children?” It’s not a valid point, and it just makes me go “But…he didn’t?”
Recently I heard a certain..boisterous shall we say
Spider-Man fan make two statements that boiled down to
Ben Reilly was a carbon copy of Peter as
evidenced by his sacrificing his life for him in Revelations
Doc Ock is probably Spider-Man’s greatest
nemesis because he killed Peter in Superior.
Here’s why one statement is illogical as a criticism and the
other is straight up bullshit.
So starting off with the first one, Ben was not merely a
carbon copy of Peter. But yes in sacrificing his life for Peter in Revelations
he did something Peter would’ve done.
And that was the fucking point.
Ben Reilly, whilst believing himself to be the real Peter
Parker and Peter a clone of him, a clone who’d lived 5 years of what should have
been Ben’s life, willingly gave up his life to save Peter.
He made a heroic sacrifice, the kind of which Peter has been
willing to make countless times.
Only he wasn’t the real Peter Parker, he was a clone.
The point being that the nature of his birth was irrelevant.
He was as much of a person and as much of a hero as Peter was, making the
fundamental point of the Clone Saga that how you live your life is more
important than where you come from.
As for the Superior thing, I’ve said this multiple times
before (although this particular Spider-Man fan refuses to listen) but Otto
neither killed Peter nor is he his greatest foe.
Call me crazy but surely Spider-Man’s greatest villain
should be the most VILLAINOUS person to him personally, since the series is you
know…about his life.
I get how you might argue that taking over his body would be
the worst thing to ever happen to someone so that villain should take the
But as should be bloody obvious to anyone who’s read enough
Spider-Man, peter cares much more about others than he does himself. The suffering
of innocent people, let alone his friends and family is all much more important
to him than any pain and suffering visited upon himself.
So we have Doc Ock taking over his body vs say, Norman
Osborn killing Gwen Stacy, faking Harry’s death, faking Aunt May’s death,
convincing him he’s a clone, rendering Flash Thompson brain damaged, maybe
killing his kid, killing Ben Reilly, causing emotional pain for his wife and
also literally torturing him for over a week with trippy drugs to turn him into
his son…and sending him out to attack his friends whilst doing that. And then
Peter has to live with that crap afterwards, in particular having to live with the
pain of losing his loved ones.
Hmmmm, I wonder which MIGHT be worse from Peter’s point of
Yeah…Otto doesn’t even come close to the top spot, even if
he did kill peter.
Which by the way, he didn’t.
Despite reading and commenting upon stories which make this
point explicitly clear, this particular Spider-Man fan continues to act as
though Doc ock killed Spider-Man in ASM #700 when that never happened. The
Peter who died in otto’s body was a copy of Peter’s mind, not the real deal. The
real deal remained in his own body, hence Ghost peter and so forth.
“Superior Spider-Man is, bar none, the coolest Spider-Man story that doesn’t involve Stan Lee and Steve Ditko. It tells the tale of Spider-Man, dying, in the body of Doc Ock, who had stolen Peter’s body. When the story begins, no one knows that Doc Ock has taken over Spidey’s body. It takes — admittedly — not super long for the reader to find out, but that singular shock is so, so profound.
Plus, Doc Ock stays in Peter Parker’s body for, um, a very long time. And as he lives, he changed Parker’s life forever — getting a doctorate, creating a company, and helping save the Universe. One of the reasons that Superior Spider-Man is one of the best face-heel turn characters is because eventually his hero side still wins out. He’s still a hero, even when he’s Doc Ock.”
1) Otto wasn’t a hero. He was a genocidal maniac who invaded people’s privacy, brutalized and blackmailed people, bodily violated Peter Parker, murdered people, raped Anna Maria Marconi and tried to rape Mary Jane. Fuck whoever calls him a ‘hero’.
2) It’s leagues and bounds nowhere even close to the coolest Spidey story outside Lee and Ditko. The Death of Gwen Stacy, The Death of Jean DeWolff, Kraven’s Last Hunt, Spider-Man: the Lost Years, Spider-Man Redemption, the Hobgoblin Saga, the Harry Osborn Saga. Literally all of those are better than Superior Spider-Man
3) This is part of a list claiming that there are other examples of superheroes going bad which are more controversial than HYDRACap.
The premise of the article is ridiculous from the outset.
Controversy is measured in the scale of the reaction to something and NOTHING has been more controversial than HYDRACap
Here is the thing the article conveniently ignores.
Roger Stern’s problem with the spider marriage was because
Spider-Man married Mary Jane specifically.
Stern is on record as saying that he thinks Spider-Man could
indeed have possibly gotten married or or could possibly be married but not to
His reasons for this seem to be that they were not right for
each other and his rationale for that is that Mary Jane is a party girl and
In other words his perception of Mary Jane was stuck in the
silver age and didn’t seem to take account of any of her character development
beginning from the Death of Gwen Stacy onwards.
Which is perplexing because Stern himself laid seeds for
Mary Jane’s later development in regards to her family history in his run.
Furthermore if Stern had such a hang up over something like
this, something other writers like J.M. DeMatteis and Peter David didn’t have I
don’t think it’s that big of a loss. Frankly I wouldn’t want a writer who’d be
so hung up on Spider-Man simply being married as their reationale for not
BTW, for whatever reasons, even though in some ways later installments were better, the first 2002 Spider-Man movie is and probably always will be, by all time favourite Spider-Man/superhero movie, as well as one of my favourite movies over all.
As a kid I waited with baited breath at the idea of getting to see Spider-Man ‘for real’ and was brokenhearted every time there was news of some kind of delay in it’s release.
In the UK reprint comic ‘Astonishing Spider-Man’ there was a semi-regular feature keeping readers up to date on the latest relevant news of the movie so I was kept fairly in the loop despite being so young and having not discovered either movie magazines, film news in newspapers or how to google stuff.
It was a magical time for me because I’d only started regularly reading Spider-Man comics (again through Astonishing, which reprinted around 3 issues worth of content every month, albeit from several years earlier) about a year or two before the film’s release.
The stuff being covered in the stuff I was reading whether by design or happy coincidence was set in the era where Norman Osborn was owner of the Daily Bugle so he was a very prominent character at the time. Part and parcel to that they also reprinted ASM #14, the debut of the Green Goblin. Not too long before the release of the movie the UK equivalent of Marvel also began reprinting Ultimate Spider-Man.
Whilst I look back and have serious problems with it, at the time Ultimate Spider-Man for me was a great hype machine from the movie as the earliest arcs in some superficial ways did resemble the state of affairs in the movie. And it was of course no coincidence that they reprinted Spider-Man’s first battle with Ultimate Goblin the same month as the movie’s release. In fact I vividly remember reading Spidey and Gobby duke it out in USM the very next day after I saw the movie.
Norman was already my favourite villain but I was Goblining out by the time the film hit.
I also had the ‘super pose-able’ Spider-Man and Green Goblin action figures and played with them relentlessly for months leading into the film. I had Norman impaled so many damn times it was ridiculous!
Whilst I see flaws in it as a film and as an adaptation now, at the time the movie was just magical to me.
Remember this was 2002. Batman and Superman and a few other superhero movies were out but most of them didn’t get too outrageous with their special effects. Superman could fly on screen sure and even fight whilst in flight but mostly that involved giving us the illusion of him in mid-air whilst performing actions he’d otherwise do on the ground.
The idea that a live action film could honestly take the fast paced, bouncing, flipping swinging Spider-Man and do it right was still a spectacle.
At least to me since I was too young to have seen the Matrix, X-Men or other films where that had been shown to be possible.
What got me, and still gets me, was how for all the stuff changed or misinterpreted from the original comics the 2002 film in many other respects is even to this day shockingly reverential.
Has there after all ever been a truly better adaptation of Amazing Fantasy #15?
In fact there are relatively few truly original embellishments in the movie. Most of the stuff has roots from somewhere in Spider-Man’s history (admittedly sometimes not for the better). The upside down kiss though is one of the mostly original things the movie did and it of course became iconic.
But when first viewing the movie I was just having baby fangasms over being able to recognize Raimi clearly taking stuff from the comics. Whilst the 90s cartoon which introduced me to Spider-Man did that too I obviously hadn’t read any of those when I first saw it.
With the 2002 movie though I was geeking out being able to silently say:
“Look he’s doing that thing from Amazing Annual #9″
“Hey this is kind of like Amazing Spider-Man #39!”
“Wow, he just got stabbed by the glider like in the Death of Gwen Stacy!”
That was a big deal to me as a 11 year old.
All this plus it was pretty thrilling ‘sneaking’ into the movie theatre (with my Dad) when I was just 1 year too young to see the movie. I kept getting worried that any minute I’d be pulled out before I saw the film.
But I did see it and vividly remember walking out of the cinema (the first day it was released because I was that hardcore about it), turning to my Dad and saying I could now die happy.
Over all it’s one of my fondest childhood memories.
There’s a moment, right before the webbing hits her when you can see Gwen accept her fate. In that moment she closes her eyes and you can see in the way she opens her mouth that she knows Peter isn’t going to catch her. In that moment Gwen Stacy is falling and she accepts her death because it was her choice. She doesn’t get to go to Oxford or kiss Peter again. She won’t ever get another chance to ruffle her brothers hair or ace a test . Right there you can see Gwen realize that her life is over, and that Peter didn’t get to her in time. It was exactly what her father didn’t want to happen, and maybe a little part of her always knew that it would end this way because dating Peter was so dangerous, but to her he was worth it. Like she said, she loved Spider-man but she loved Peter Parker more even if it meant free falling to her death. Right in that moment you can watch Gwen Stacy close her eyes and realize that even if Peter caught her one hundred times before, this time he didn’t and she’s bracing for impact.
GWEN STACY AND THE SHACKLES OF BEING A ROMANTIC INTEREST
By Defne S.
Editor’s note: This week, we’re excited to present to you a guest article from Defne S., coming to us all the way from Istanbul, Turkey! You can find her at her Tumblr (@Sirdef) and hopefully here with more articles in the future!
You don’t need to take a women’s studies class to know the words “Romantic Interest”- but generally you need to have an understanding of gender dynamics surrounding Romantic Interests, the disparity between the number of male romantic interests vs. female (and the respective portrayals), and the tropes revolving around the romantic interest to really understand why it’s a negative term.