semi-auto-shotgun

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Shortlane Scavenger 9mm Luger 12 Gauge Shotgun Adapter Review,

Now that I have a 12 gauge break action double barrel shotgun, one thing I’ve always wanted to try are those bizarre chamber adapters. Ever wonder if there was a way to fire 9mm out of a 12 gauge shotgun? Well thanks to Shortlane there is. Chamber adapters are fairly simple tools, basically a metal cylinder with a hole bored in the center to accommodate the cartridge. The adapter is inserted into the chamber of the shotgun, and the cartridge inserted into the adapter. Note that they cannot be used in pump or semi auto shotguns, only break actions.

They type I am firing is the Shortlane Scavenger series in 9mm Luger. It’s the simplest model which is smoothbore and 3 inches long. They also make the “Bug Out” series which is rifled and 3 inches long, the “Zombie Series” which is rifled and 5 inches long, and finally the “Pathfinder” series which is rifled and 8 inches long. They come in common pistol calibers such as .22 long rifle, 9mm luger, .380 ACP, .40 SW,.45 ACP, .45 Long Colt,.357 magnum, and .38 special. Rifled models also feature rubber O rings to make the inserts fit more snugly in the chamber. Another company called MCA sports makes rifled inserts that are 10 inches and 18 inches long, with more exotic pistol calibers, and three rifle calibers; .30-40 krag, .30-30, and 7.62x39.

Now I’m under no delusion that I’m going to get great performance out of these. Basically using these chamber inserts is like firing a smoothbore snubby revolver with a loose barrel. The bullet will not spin, definitely something that will ruin accuracy. It’s fired from only a 3 inch barrel which will decrease velocity greatly, and the insert probably vibrates with each shot. Also, my shotgun is meant for wingshooting, meaning the front sight (bead) is made for aerial targets, and thus shoots high when firing at ground targets. 

So is the Shortland adapter in 9mm as crappy as I thought it would be? Well, I’m proud to say that I can easily achieve MOA accuracy, if MOA was measured at five feet. Yeah, these things suck. I was firing American Eagle brand 9mm Luger FMJ with 115 grain bullets. Note that these inserts are not made to safely fire +P ammunition.  After doing some “sighting in” I determined that I needed to hold low, right at the bottom the target, and to the right, down at the right had corner. I first shot open handed at 25 yards, firing 12 rounds. The instruction manual says to expect practical accuracy at 10 yards, but I decided to push it a bit. 

At this range where the bullet will hit is near unpredictable.   I can hold in the same place, but sometimes it will fly high, fly low, and when it does hit the target it’s not anywhere near the bullseye. After firing at 25 yards, I moved up half distance to around 12 yards. At 12 yards I got much better results without missing the target and getting something close to a predictable group. Notice how the bullet holes look mangled rather than being clean round bullet holes. That’s because without rifling the bullet isn’t spinning, and it quickly loses flight stability and begins tumbling.

Here are my results, the left target at 25 yards and right at 10 yards.

So yeah, these things really aren’t good for much of anything. If you have a 12 gauge shotgun, and some assorted ammo you want to make go bang, these inserts will do.  I guess if you only had a shotgun and only a box of 9mm, you could use it for hunting if you were starving and desperate. I wouldn’t hunt with it under normal circumstances, but if I was starving and had no other options, it would be a practical tool, though far from ideal. One advantage is that it does add more versatility to a shotgun. I could see people in the Great Depression appreciating these inserts, despite their limitations. Back in the days of my Great Grandfather, all the family could afford was a 12 gauge double barrel, which was used not only to feed the family with small game and birds, but also large game when loaded with slugs, and pressed into service scaring away Ku Klux Klan thugs whenever they decided it was “harass Italian Catholic Immigrant” day.

Finally I must state that the Scavenger series I used is the simplest and crudest model offered. They retail for $24.99 a piece. The longer rifled models are  more expensive but probably much more effective.  I’m going to purchase the 5 inch rifled model and test it to see how much better they perform. If I find they are practical I might get other calibers, and perhaps one of the 8 inch rifled models. While the scavenger might suck, I’ve seen youtube videos were shooters have gotten some pretty impressive accuracy out of the 5 and 8 inch rifled models. If they are practical, I might also considering getting 10 inch inserts from MCA sports in a rifle caliber cartridge, either .30-30 or 7.62x39 (which actually have similar ballistics).  We shall see.

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Vepr 12

Russian semi-auto 12 gauge shotgun that uses an RPK style receiver and share nearly all the same ergonomic controls of most AK rifles. The Vepr 12 is viewed to be a much better shotgun than it’s predecessor and competition, the Saiga 12. They had originally escaped being banned from import under the Obama administration during the first round of Russian sanctions. Sadly due to increased pressure, the Trump administration enacted another wave of sanctions which eventually included Molot, the factory that produces them. (GRH)

What I learned in my first 3gun matches

I’ve done three multi/3gun matches in the past month and I figured I’d kinda write a little about what I learned and somethings I’ll be working on to get better. Being completely new to firearms competitions, no USPA, IDPA…anything… i had no idea what the matches were going to be like. 

The first thing i learned is… its pretty hard. The events are not just shooting, there is running, obstacles, weird rules for certain stages (such as target sequences, firing positions, etc.) and some times you have to carry heavy objects (I’ve already eaten dirt a few times.. not pretty). The point is it can be as intense as you want it to be, but the club I’ve shot with loves to have people come that aren’t potential badasses, so don’t be discouraged if you’re just out to test yourself, have fun or just shoot for the hell of it. I personally am trying to improve enough to actually compete ( I cant play a sport just to play, I want to be good, but that’s just me) 

The second thing I learned was that this is going to cost a lot of money if i really want to take on the sport. Already having a pistol and rifle my first addition to my rig would be a shotgun (ill get more into that later), after watching a few matches before i started to play the game I’d decided to get semi-auto. I bought the shotgun, then a side shell holder, then a jimmy clip for shells on my belt, I needed a good retention pistol mag holster, an AR mag holster… See where Im going with this? (granted you can get by using pockets if you just want to play, but this post isn’t really for those guys). On top of equipment most round counts in clubs are 150 for pistol, 150 rifle, 75 target shells and 10 slugs… you’ll also be shooting steel a bunch, so bi metal ammo and steel core are off limits (this means no tul ammo or red army). So in my area that cost about 150 bucks if I’m buying that ammo new, I personally only train with reloads, I’d rather be super sure about my ammo at a match. So yeah, its a lot of money, though there are ways to keep it cheaper, I’m sure. 

On my equipment.

For my rifle I used one I built. 16 inch barrel, standard BCG, magpul stock, Milspec pistol grip, Vltor rail, SOTA upper, Bushnell drop zone 1x4 223 optic, and an Elftmann tactical 3gun trigger. Besides the rail and trigger its pretty standard. 
Worked fine but I did get some light primer strikes on the Elftmann trigger so I ended up changing it to a CMC trigger, I really like Elft’s triggers but I would rather have them in my MPX than my competition rifle because my CMC is just more dependable in my lil ole opinion. 

My Bushnell optic works well for the $120 i spent on it, though I rarely train with magnified optics so I’ve had a lot to learn about them. I’m more of an irons/red dot kinda chick. The optic does get me through about 500 rounds without the zero getting off, but it needs to be checked before each match in my opinion ( my last match i suffered quite a bit because i thought it was “good to go”). 

My pistol is a Sig P226, though, Ive recently been thinking about changing this platform to a Sig P320 full size RX, (This will put me in the open division instead of the tactical division) or a CZ P-09 for a few reasons, the first being the weight of my 226. The p226 has a metal frame and is considerably heavier than a polymer gun. While this is my favorite pistol in my personal collection, I think ill be getting a polymer CZ P-09… but only because its more available than the Sig P320 RX full size model, plus from what I understand there are more aftermarket parts for the P-09. All that said, my P226 performs pretty well, and its a pretty accurate gun so replacing it isn’t a super big priority right now. 

On to my shotgun: I chose a CZ 712 Semi Auto 12 gauge. For the price of $485-ish I thought it would be a good start for 3 gunning. The only thing I did to this gun was buy an extended magazine tube to increase my guns capacity from 4+1 to 11+1. The magazine tube extends past the end about 7 inches from a 20 inch barrel, its kinda ostentatious if I’m being real here. I did end up cerakoting it bazooka green because I’m a tad did ostentatious myself. 

The shotgun ran through about 600-ish rounds perfectly but now I’m having a few issues with it, maybe once I get it performing well again ill expand on that.

My first match

The match started around 930 with a shooters safety and stage brief, they even had a shorter one right before for new shooters. During the brief they discussed the importances of safety and the “180 rule”. The 180 rule is about the angle of where your muzzle can be pointed at all times. There is a zero tolerance policy with this, so even an accident puts you out for the day. I haven’t found it really difficult to maintain this rule, but I also saw a few people get close and having a range office yell “muzzle,muzzle!”, and i can see how if you’re not paying attention it could be an easy thing to do… which is why they spent 15 minutes talking about how its not only very unsafe and the most common DQ for new shooters. No one from my squad got a DQ that day. 

Some other things that could get you disqualified were flagging anyone, including yourself and dropping a fire arm. There are some other violations like running with your finger in a trigger guard, but I’m not sure if that disqualifies you for the entire event or not. 

My first stage was a rifle/pistol stage. The rules were that you started with an empty magazine in your rifle with the bolt forward and a magazine of 15 rounds holstered, from there you would reload the rifle and chamber it, and engage targets. The first two targets were paper silhouettes that needed to be engaged twice in the “B” zone or once in the “A” zone, after those targets were neutralized there were three steel silhouettes at 120,150, and 200 yards that needed one hit each. Once all of the rifle targets were hit (or you ran out of ammo I guess) you had to ditch the rifle on safe in a full barrel and move on to the pistol targets. First there was a steel target tree were you “send and receive” the round steel from side to side on six targets. The next ones were four sets of two, ten inch steel yellow targets set about 20 yards apart from each other that you would double tap each before moving on/running to the next. End stage. I did ok on that stage besides a few light primer strikes, finishing that stage with 144.85 seconds on the timer, nothing to write home about. 

I posted the rest of the stages from that day on youtube so thats really the only stage I’m going describe in detail. 

Moving on to the problems and more difficult aspects I’ve experienced. 

1. Shot gun reloads are the toughest part for me. Before I bought my CZ i can count the times Ive ever shot a shotgun on two hands, so this part of 3gun has been the most challenging. My goal is to spend the least amount of time reloading a shotgun as possible, the first match I did I had no way to hold shells and was picking them out of my pocket… this took up an insane amount of time and from them on out i made it a priority to get shell holders and practice shot guns a lot more. 

2. Finding a good holster for my pistol is now more of a priority. I’m running a drop leg serpa right now but i might be getting a safari land one after this season. During the first match I ran this serpa on my belt, but i didnt like reaching that far up my body to draw when I’m in a timed event. 

3. Planning out your stage more than just listening to the stage brief really is important. Visualizing your run a few times has helped me, if I dont do this I tend to move ahead of myself and have to repeat a target or literally take a step back. 

4. Failing to check or properly tune my equipment has been the worst of my issues lately. I’m getting far more anal about things that I used to not get upset over, after all, I’ve basically just been a plinker or an ammo waster for about two years now. When something happens on the range like a small equipment problem or a jam, its no big deal when you only get one shot at a stage thats timed… being a little competitive it’s harder to just brush it off and not beat myself up about it. 

Over all I’ve had a fantastic time even when I’m sucking really bad. No one is rude or snobby about me asking lots of annoying noob questions, even if you have a bad run they always say “good job” and its a very good way to spend an afternoon and make new friends. There were 70-something competitors at my first match and roughly 60 each at the others. for the record, I’m playing in mostly “outlaw” matches which are not a part of 3gun nation, but from what I hear the rules are basically the same. 

To anyone thinking about starting up 3gun: be prepared to have a fun time being humbled… and bring sunscreen 

If you need at TL:DR its probably not interesting to you anyway. 

Significance of “15”in AR-15

Someone asked about it, I made a post but then it got deleted when I was making some changes to it.

the 15 is merely the number assigned to the design, usually in the order that they were completed. here is a list of Armalite’s products from Wiki:

  • AR-1 “Parasniper”, bolt-action rifle 
  • AR-3, 7.62×51mm NATO semi-auto rifle 
  • AR-5, .22 Hornet bolt-action survival rifle 
  • AR-7 “Explorer”, .22 LR semi-auto survival rifle 
  • AR-9, semi-auto 12-gauge shotgun 
  • AR-10, 7.62×51mm NATO battle rifle 
  • AR-11, .222 Remington assault rifle 
  • AR-12, 7.62×51mm NATO battle rifle 
  • AR-13, hyper-velocity anti-aircraft machine gun 
  • AR-14, .243 Winchester or 7.62×51mm NATO semi-auto rifle 
  • AR-15, .223 Remington modern sporting rifle / semi-automatic carbine 
  • AR-16, 7.62×51mm NATO battle rifle 
  • AR-17, semi-auto 12-gauge shotgun 
  • AR-18, .223 Remington assault rifle 
  • AR-180, .223 Remington semi-auto rifle

controllercontrolledrevolution  asked:

What was the most reliable firearm used in World War One?

This is a question that is impossible to answer. WWI was a huge war involving a myriad of firearms such as bolt action rifles, semi auto rifles, submachine guns, shotguns, heavy machine guns, light machine guns, semi auto pistols, revolvers, even weird things like old outdated breechloaders and lever action winchesters. Firearms used came from France, Spain, Portugal, the UK, Denmark, Germany, Austria, Hungary, Romania, Greece, Russia, Norway, Sweden, Canada, the United States, Switzerland, Turkey, Belgium, the Netherlands, Mexico, and Japan.

My point is it’s impossible to compare all of the hundreds of models of firearms used by different countries. There were a lot of really great firearms and its difficult to merely pick one particular model and definitively judge it as being the most reliable.

Chainsaw

This might be the only time I would consider the “chainsaw” grip from the Mossberg 500 Chainsaw to be somewhat useful. On the Mossberg it was there to help actuate the pump-action but at least on a semi-auto shotgun like the Saiga 12, it could be a stable grip option. That is if you’re just shooting from the hip and emptying a 20 or 30 round drum. (GRH)

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Remington Model 11

A licensed copy of the Browning A5, the Remington Model 11 is a semi-auto 12 gauge shotgun. It employs a long recoil means of operation where the bolt and barrel both move rearward in the receiver. This gives it a bit rougher recoil than what most people would expect if they’ve fired more modern semi-auto shotguns. The one in the photos has been modified; normally you have a full length barrel, often times with a compensator installed. You can still find Model 11′s for around $300~ or so. (GRH)

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Long…

Several photos of long barreled Vepr 12 shotguns. Some European countries that allow for semi-auto shotgun ownership often require that the barrel be a certain length, which I think in this case is 27" or 28" long. For example, from what I was told by some UK gun owners, a shotgun with a barrel shorter than 24" would not be allowed on a shotgun permit/certificate  and thus be prohibited. (GRH)

SPAS-12

The Italian made dual-action (both pump and semi-auto) shotgun that is probably one of the most recognizable firearms due to its constant use in movies and video games. Note the old style “paddle” safety that was recalled due to reports of the gun firing off a round when flipping from Safe to Fire or vice versa. (GRH)