kylo killed his father in cold blood, how do you see him realistically making reparations for that in the film?
Well, I think you’re looking at a fictional story too literally if you believe these actions are one-to-one related to the real world. They are terrible - for SURE! Kylo Ren, as he is now, is a dumbass and a jerk. No arguments there. But those of us who like his character see a potential for masterful storytelling here. Obviously if this were the real world… I’d be terrified of someone like Kylo. But we are talking about a SPACE OPERA here… not your next-door neighbor.
I think one thing anti-Kylo people do is look at these stories through a real world lens… but that’ just bad story and character analysis. You’re not looking at his characterization as a DEVICE for the plot - and ultimately for the core morals and lessons involved in that overarching plot.
Fairy tales and particularly Star Wars are not tales about perfect people who make all the right choices. It’s about people making mistakes, and learning from those mistakes, to ultimately do the right thing IN THE END. It’s about the central messages and themes we take away from it all. Characters serve a specific purpose - to make us learn things and see things anew. You better bet Kylo has that purpose.
And of course, there is even precedent in the Star Wars universe teaches us that anyone can be saved. Just look at the actions of Darth Vader. His actions were at least - and not limited to -
-turning on the Jedi Order and becoming a literal Sith Lord
-killing dozens and dozens of children in cold blood (far more chilling than two old dudes if you ask me)
-accusing his pregnant wife of cheating with his best friend
-accusing his pregnant wife of being a traitor and committing treason
-Force choking his pregnant wife
-killing his pregnant wife
-trying to kill his best friend, who was his father figure
-mass genocide on a grand, galaxy-wide scale
-kidnapping and torturing his daughter
-killing his own father figure and former best friend - Obi-wan
-kidnapping and torturing his daughter’s boyfriend
-freezing his daughter’s boyfriend in carbonite
-kidnapping and cutting off his son’s hand
-trying to manipulate his son to join the Dark Side
-kidnapping his son and taking him to the most evil man to have ever lived in the galaxy - the Emperor
That’s not even everything but I’m tired already. Vader was busy y’all. Yet Vader was redeemed in the end - through the love of his son.
But beyond that, in the context of Star Wars, Kylo Ren’s actions are bad - but they’re not irredeemable bad. I’m not excusing anything he’s done, and I think his character HAS to suffer dearly for it. And I think he will, in many intimate and personal ways.
But, I gotta say, you’re looking at his action out of context. We have seen much more vicious, unrepenting characters in SW, and that Kylo is already showing guilt and shame is a pretty big tip off he’s headed for redemption. And, also, I think this action - being dramatic and horrific as it was - has to MEAN something, in the greater story. More than just, “KYLO IS EEEEEVIIIIL MWAHAHAHA!!!”
First, if you’re a Han Solo fan, you should want his death to mean something - and that’s was Harrison Ford wanted all along too.
But Han’s death is meaningless if he couldn’t actually save his son - like he went there to do. If Ben Solo doesn’t come back, Han died for nothing.
I think Ben Solo - for the sake of the story - had to kill his father to realize that Snoke is lying to him and manipulating him. JJ himself has confirmed that Kylo didn’t want to kill his father but thought he had to. We don’t know why that is yet… but, he thought it was the only way to further whatever cause (which we the audience have not entirely been made aware of yet - keep that in mind) he is trying to accomplish.
The thing is: JJ confirms it didn’t actually help him get further to the Dark Side. Can you imagine how that’s going to play out in his character?? How his trust with Snoke will be shaken? How his interactions with Rey will inform his character arc from here on out?
Why y’all think he failed his fight so poorly against Rey? You think he’s that bad of a Force user that he can lose to a total n00b?? Nah, he was grief-stricken and horrified at what he’d done - Adam’s excellent acting skills should tell that story, even without JJ’s commentary.
NOT SAYING that makes it ok - but in the CONTEXT of a fictional universe, showing your bad guy grief stricken over a terrible act he’s just committed is a huge sign he is not a big bad. It’s a huge sign he’s going to change.
Kylo realized he fucked up, and Snoke is a liar. Now, he will probably stay in denial for a little bit, but eventually he’ll have to come to terms with this. And I think he’s probably going to want to go after Snoke with a passionate vengence - and ultimately help Rey do that.
And that brings me to the next point. SPOILERS FOR AFTERMATH AND BLOODLINE BELOW.
We know from the Aftermath series that Ben Solo had been manipulated, groomed, and preyed upon by Snoke since he was a FETUS. Now, I want you to imagine that. A FETUS is being touched by the Dark Side IN THE WOMB from this terrible dark energy - which Leia confirms is Snoke in TFA. Again, Kylo is responsible for his decisions, but to say that he cannot learn and grow past a lifetime of abuse and manipulation, that he cannot escape that no matter what he tries to do if he learns his lesson… y’all that is some fucked up thinking, not gonna lie.
Finally, and this is the most important part:
WE DON’T KNOW BEN SOLO’S STORY YET.
WE DON’T KNOW WHY HE IS DOING WHAT HE IS DOING.
We are led to believe he thinks what he is doing is ultimately RIGHT and GOOD.
Again - not excusing his behavior - but if we are to understand Ben Solo, I think we have to understand that he thinks his actions are necessary to save the galaxy. Something has happened to convince him that what he’s doing is the only way.
If you thought killing your father would save the galaxy… wouldn’t you do it? I’m sorry, but I probably would if I thought it would save BILLIONS OR TRILLIONS of people. I would hate myself - as Kylo Ren presumably does. But I would probably do it.
Remember, it’s a war, and even in the real world, family on opposite sides of war kill each other. It’s sad and tragic… but it is even a part of our world. There’s no excuse that can make up for what Kylo did… but I do hope it forces him to stop doing the wrong things and realize his way is NOT going to save people, like he may think he is doing.
And, not only that, but
Han himself knew the sacrifice he was potentially making.
As a father, he wanted to make that sacrifice, no matter the risks. I, for one, don’t want to see his sacrifice go in vain. I’d like to see it be Ben’s turning point back toward the light.
Also, we know from Bloodlinethat when the New Republic learned of Leia and Luke being Vader’s children, they went after Leia. She even faced an assassination attempt and openly worries what could happen to Luke and Ben - that someone might go after them.
We don’t know what happened to turn Ben Solo to the Dark Side. We are all assuming he found out about Vader and went batshit crazy and killed a bunch of younglings a la Anakin 2.0.
But we don’t actually KNOW that. Wait for the story! Until we know everything, we are shooting in the dark to assassinate a character we know nothing about!
We also know Rian Johnson helped Claudia Gray write certain aspects of Bloodline - that he gave suggestions to plot points to help inform the audience in preparation for TLJ!
My speculation, based on what I read in Bloodline, is that someone in the New Republic didn’t like that Vader’s son and grandson were playing around with the Force and targeted them - possibly trying to destroy anything and everything Jedi-related, including people.
A betrayal like this from the New Republic to Ben would be everything - it means his home, his family who lied to him for years, his justice system - ALL OF IT - cannot be trusted.
It would explain why Luke went into hiding, too. Luke is a pacifist who would rather walk away than confront an entire government. Even if the government as a whole didn’t do anything, it’s possible individuals in the New Republic would based on such shocking news. I imagine a significant amount of people would be terrified of Vader’s offspring and descendants furthering their legacy in the Force.
Regardless of speculation, we don’t know Ben Solo’s story yet. Wait for the story, see what happens. And, sure, if by the end of it, Kylo Ren is still running around with clenched fists and ramming his sword into every old man and console that comes along his path…
Sure, then we can say, “that guy is an irredeemable asshole!!!”
But, I for one, think they’re going to build a pretty epic story and the big “twist” for TLJ will be something that changes our opinion of Ben and his actions entirely - to the point that he will be redeemable and sympathetic.
The fact is, I think even most anti-Kylo people will be able to accept
his character if he starts making good decisions and gets a well told
back story. Let’s trust the almighty Lucasfilm gods to give us a great story that challenges our expectations and assumptions - which THEY ALWAYS do! And I also think Rey is going to be integral to that change and they will NEED each other to figure it all out.
poncho-wearing asshole sticks out tongue at gizka, probably shoots it minutes later
lost jedi oc numero dos Feebduaksre Kenu! (or just feeb if you know them well/are looking for a shot in the face). they’re a bounty hunter/merc for hire working with nautolan datemate Tehnrun Vrets when the new jedi order comes calling. they’re probably just a bit violent for a jedi, but no one’s perfect, right?
they’re a short, cheerful fucker who’s liable to go from laughing like a hyena at a joke to pointing a blaster in your face while still grinning like you’re on the punchline. (the punchline is the blaster in your face.) theyre actually pretty excited to join the order for some reason, though, so tehnrun puts up with it for their sake.
(also, somehow, they manage to befriend mira, who’s baffled to find that despite her caustic dismissal she has a very cheerful, trigger-happy rodian on her side)
In that moment it seemed like there were only two options: help Master Windu arrest the Chancellor and secret Sith Lord or heed to Sheev Palpatine’s begging and turn against the Jedi. To Anakin, it felt as if the same battle that was playing out before him, light versus dark, was happening within his own mind. Windu, a man who seemed to hate him, who would condemn his marriage if he knew of it, and a member of a flawed order, or Palpatine, a master of darkness, the Sith Lord who they have been scouring the galaxy for, the embodiment of everything Anakin had been taught was evil, but also his friend, and the man who promised his wife would live. All the tension within him, all the emotions always pulling at the seams within him seemed to be breaking apart, Anakin wanted to scream. But then, in a split second, a third option revealed itself.
If somebody told him that his comlink beeping would stop him from falling to the darkside, Anakin Skywalker would have laughed, except that is exactly what happened. Anakin and Padmé had an emergency frequency. If used, no matter when or where the other person was the message would go through. Up until that moment of Anakin’s inner battle and the physical fight in front of him, the frequency had never been used. But then there was a beep and the sweet sound of his wife’s voice filled the darkness of the room with light and soothed his inner turmoil, “Ani,” her voice wavered and her mixture of fear and excitement was clear despite the static, “I’ve gone into labor. I’m on my way to Coruscant Medical. Meet me there, please, I need you Ani.”
His wife was scared and she needed him. Palpatine’s promises didn’t matter in that moment, Anakin realized. He’d been so consumed in his own fears he had not spared his wife single thought.
That was the third option, Padmé. Without giving Windu or Palpatine a second glance, Anakin sprinted from the room.
Hrm. I’ve been meaning to write something of a serious piece on what I consider the Jedi Order’s greatest flaw, and how that nearly contributed to their destruction twice in a period of four thousand years, but that’s less of an unpopular opinion and more of me illustrating how much of a nerd I am by illustrating how seriously I take a fictional universe. Oh well.
You see, before Lucas directed the prequels and illustrated much of what the Jedi Order was like, at least in the period of the Old Republic’s decline and the Rise of the Empire, the EU writers and the fans had to speculate what the order was actually like based on what little we saw of the Jedi from Obi-Wan and Yoda. As a result, if you read the older material (much of which is non canon now thanks to the new trilogy) you might see a very different picture of the Jedi than you might expect. Instead of the one master per apprentice tradition, there were singular masters who taught many students, later titled Jedi Watchman who oversaw the security of whole star systems, and their philosophies weren’t always singular. Another example that goes against the grain of the prequel era Jedi was the presence of Jedi Lords who existed a thousand years before the films. A Jedi going so far to call themselves a “Lord” as their Sith archenemies might, would be considered anathema to the Jedi of Yoda’s era.
There are other examples, such as groups of Jedi that integrated with the culture of their native system, such as the Corellian Jedi of Han Solo’s homeworld and the Teepo Paladins, a sect that broke off the order due to discarding their lighstabers in favor of blasters (they could use the Force to alter the physics of their blaster bolts to due some Matrix style stuff).
But the greatest difference between the Jedi of Lucas’ prequel era and the Jedi that already existed in the speculated fiction was that many of them had whole families of their own. Nomi Sunrider, the woman who would become Yoda’s equivalent in her Age, had been married prior to becoming a Jedi, and had a daughter Vima who would eventually follow in her mother’s footsteps to become a Jedi herself. Nomi’s husband, Andur, who’d originally planned on being a Jedi instead of Nomi, had fully expected that he’d be able to train Vima himself before his murder at the hands of gangsters. In the same time period, the Qel-Droma family was famous for having many members present among the Order, with at least three cousins involved in the business of being Jedi.
One of the core plots of the prequels was that the Jedi Order didn’t permit its members to be married and have families. Recruitment of new Jedi was done through the adoption of children who were strong in the Force randomly among the citizens of the galactic republic. This is a rather huge gap in beliefs and practices among the Jedi. So, how to address the difference in beliefs?
The way they ended up illustrating how these differing philosophies coexisting proved fascinating to me. It also highlighted what I began to see as the greatest flaw of the Jedi, and why I have so much faith that Luke Skywalker’s going to be able to shed that weakness once and for all.
Lets begin with what’s considered to be the Old Republic Era, specifically the ten year period that began with Mandalorian Wars, reached its peak during the Jedi Civil War, and finally concluded with a number of unseen but bloody conflicts called the Dark Wars. Just prior to the beginning of the Mandalorian Wars, the Jedi of this war were recovering from a major conflict with the Sith Lord Exar Kun, their numbers diminished to the point that even decades later they hadn’t quite recovered. As a result, many of the traditions that stressed individual strands of Jedi culture and formation of families were discouraged but not totally censured by the High Council. Given time, it’s likely that we’d see many of the practices of the prequel era Jedi take root in the order. But the onset of the Mandalorian Wars ensured that the Jedi would never find out.
A massive invasion against the Republic by the Mandalorian Neo-Crusaders, a revival of the Mandalorian warrior culture that was led by their supreme leader, Mandalore the Ultimate, in the hopes of conquering the Republic and testing their might against the Jedi. Except, the Jedi did not fight. Still wounded from the last major war, the Jedi Council was hesitant to be drawn into another, along with warnings from the Force that their was something dark on the horizon that went beyond the Mandalorian Crusade.
Whether the Council was right or not, a group of Jedi led by a charismatic figure who would one day be known as Revan refused to the let the Republic fall without their assistance. They split from the Order, forming what was initially called the Jedi Crusaders in direct contrast to the Mandalorian invaders. Revan defeated the Mandalorians, breaking their fleet at Malachor V, and personally defeating Mandalore the Ultimate in single combat.
He should have returned to the Republic a conquering hero. Instead, Revan vanished, and later returned as a Dark Lord of the Sith, at the head of a massive invasion fleet consisting alien technology and manned by fallen Jedi and Republic soldiers. Thus began what would later be called the Jedi Civil War, for though Revan, and later Malak ,his apprentice, called themselves Sith, to the greater galaxy, it was as though the Jedi Order had turned on itself, with the Republic being trapped between them.
At war’s end, barely a hundred Jedi were left, and they found themselves targeted by Sith Assassins, reducing an already reduced order to barely a few. When the Dark Wars, as this period was known, ended, what few Jedi were left essentially had to start over from scratch.
The key part I took away from this age, which were illustrated in the Knights of the Old Republic series, was that the Jedi had a serious flaw in that many of their own number, including some of their greatest number such as Revan, fell to the Dark Side. The second of the two games, KotOR 2, the SIth Lords, was a powerful deconstruction of the Jedi and the Star Wars universe, much of it focused on the Force and its sometimes contradictory nature. Kreia, a fascinating character inspired by both the Emperor and Obi Wan Kenobi, was the mouthpiece for much of this deconstruction, forcing the player to reevalute their beliefs on the Force, the Jedi, and the Sith. The Jedi of this age were ultimately destroyed because of their inability to examine the flaws and their teachings, and more importantly why they were falling to the Dark Side. The survivors, the majority of which consisted of the Students of a Jedi who’d been exiled from the Order for following Revan to war, and yet had been the only one to return to justify their decision to fight the Mandalorians . Her teachings proved the bedrock of a Jedi Order that was able to restore itself in the three hundred years prior to the next major conflict of the Dark Side, and was open to to varying interpretations of the Force and its meanings.
Fast forward three thousand years, and history repeats itself. The Sith have returned and conquered much of the galaxy, ruling from individual kingdoms across the Galaxy, trapping those within their rule from rescue, and once again the High Council seemed slow to intervene. In frustration, many Jedi went off on their own to fight the Sith, and the they did so spectacularly. Their efforts were so successful that in gratitude, many thankful citizens gave the Jedi the keys to their individual kingdoms, providing the onset of the age of the Jedi Lords, a schism of Jedi who held baronies and titles across the galaxy, formed families, and even managed to occasionally hold political office as the Supreme Chancellor multiple times! They even formed what was unoffically known as the Jedi Grand Council in direct contrast to the more traditional High Council.
The Jedi of this era were written for the background of the popular Jedi Knight Games that starred Kyle Katarn, a rebel turned Jedi Knight. Katarn’s adventures would lead him to the Valley of the Jedi, which came to be during the end of the Age of the Jedi Lords , or New Sith Wars as they are more commonly. The original Jedi Knight was when the title of Jedi Lord was first introduced. I can only assume after reading the lore of the Jedi in these particular storylines, that the writers assumed that the ancient Jedi must have shared to traits with western knights, including families, noble titles, and a very martial stance on fighting the Dark Side.
I confess I wouldn’t have minded if this turned out to be the case for the Order, as much of their attributes, a dedication to going into dark places for the sake of the innocent, tight bonds of loyalty, and being not unlike many of the Paladins on this blog. But having them being a rival schism of the more traditional Jedi provides some interesting story opportunities.
Opportunities that manifested in the Battle of Ruussan, where two massive armies of Jedi Lords and Sith destroyed each other in massive blast of Force energy, forming the Valley of the Jedi. This seemingly ended the Sith once and for all, and severely weakened the Jedi who did not follow the High Council, their diminished numbers swiftly turning those who still lived into a minority. A minority that found itself censured as the High Council brought the Jedi back to their way of thinking, drawing the Jedi together to the Temple on Coruscant, which would become a the primary training center for the next thousand years, along with enforcing the one master, one padawan rule to prevent any one Jedi from having significant influence over the Order’s future.
Ironically, the Sith were reforming at this time as well. Darth Bane, partly due to recognizing that the treacherous nature of the Sith and his own personal beliefs on the nature of the Force, instigated the Rule of Two, ensuring there would then only two Sith Lords at any given time. One master to hold the power, and an apprentice to crave it. The Sith then retreated into the shadows, and would not resurface for a thousand years.
And finally we enter the age of the films. The Jedi of this era, though they don’t initially realize it, are under attack from the most devious Sith Lord to ever live: Darth Sidious, or as he’s known from his kindly facade, Sheev Palpatine.
As of yet, how much of what occurred is due to Palpatine’s singular cunning or was part of the thousand year plan that began with Bane’s reformation of the Sith is uncertain. But the fact of the matter is that he crippled the Jedi well before he ever revealed his true nature, taking advantage of every weakness the Order had given itself in the aftermath of the Battle of Ruussan. He blinded them to future by clouding the Temple itself via an ancient Sith Shrine that was hidden beneath it. He took advantage of their isolationism to ferment resentment among the Republic for the Jedi. He orchestrated a war that was meant solely to grant him massive political power, and slowly bleed the Jedi over a long conflict, and finally, his ultimate coup was turning an emotionally vulnerable and desperate young man to his way of thinking.
The result is devastating for both the Jedi and the galaxy. The Order is betrayed, its future destroyed by the man who was destined to bring balance to the Force. Democracy is willing destroyed, and replaced with a tyrannical Empire that will rule the galaxy with an iron fist.
And two small children are hidden away, tiny lights hidden in the dark. Their planned destiny is to restore galaxy when the time is right. They do, but not in the way their mentors expect, and galaxy is better for it. Luke Skywalker does not slay Sidious, or his father. Because he is not afraid of either either death nor darkness, he redeems Anakin Skywalker, and the Galaxy is given the chance to heal.
Looking back at all of it, all the history and the events that led to so many deaths, and war on massive scale, I recognized one common thread, a reason why history repeated itself.
Fear. The answer is fear. Specifically, fear of the Dark Side. Rather than risk any interaction with it, large sections of the Order have over the eons have insulated the Jedi and reduced the risk of corruption by preventing conflicting teachings and isolation from the greater galaxy.
This isolationism made them vulnerable to Sidious’ manipulations, and gave him the opportunity to turn Anakin Skywalker by utilizing his fear of loss. The lack of any varying branches of philosophy also made them predictable, and unable to adapt to a changing political situation. Essentially, what one disillusioned Jedi called Council’s “Damnable sense of over caution” made the Order stagnant and crippled while their greatest enemy only grew stronger in the shadows.
Yet, I have hope for the Jedi of the future. Luke was instructed with the bare essentials on becoming a Jedi Knight, and unlike his teachers was still able to see the kernel of light in Darth Vader’s heart. As this quotation from one of my favorite Star Wars books illustrates, whatever new shape the Jedi take in the future, under Luke’s guidance, they won’t have the same weakness that destroyed them before.
Kar Vastor:I have known Jedi. Many, many years ago. That knowing was not a gladness for me. I believed I would never know another, and I rejoiced in that belief. But it is a gladness for me to be proven wrong. I am happy to have known you, Jedi Luke Skywalker. You are more than they were.
Luke Skywalker: That’s–I mean, thanks, but I barely know anything.
Kar Vastor:So you believe. But I say to you: you are greater than the Jedi of former days.
Luke Skywalker: What makes you say that?
Kar Vastor:Because unlike the Knights of old, Jedi Luke Skywalker… You are not afraid of the dark
Vader’s crimes - in the grand scope of things - were overwhelmingly worse - Could explain how that is when Vader and Kylo have done pretty much the exact same things except for patricide?
Kylo has (as far as canon has confirmed):
-killed Lor San Tekka -ordered the killing of villagers -Force gripped a guy while saying, “What girl?!” -destroyed a console -interrogated two people in a time of war -destroyed an interrogation chair -killed Han - canonically instantly regrets it -got charged by Finn and fought in a very BRUTALLY mean duel -Sliced Finn’s back -Asked to be Rey’s teacher in the Force - didn’t mention evil overlord NOR the Dark Side - just the neutral Force -Lost two battles - one of the mind, the other physical - against the heroine in the first 1/3 of the story -got his face cut up real good -Looked sad a lot
This is like the 5th time I’ve had to list out Vader’s crimes, but w/e here we go again…
-betrayed the Jedi Order -become a Sith Lord -betrayed his best friend/father figure, Obi-wan -accused his wife of cheating with his best friend/father figure -accused his wife of being a traitor -killed a bunch of defenseless children - canonically lies to his wife’s face over it -Force choked his pregnant wife -killed his pregnant wife -tried to kill his best friend/father figure -become Darth Vader - one of the greatest, most notorious villains in cinematic history -committed mass genocide on multiple occasions on a grand, super-galactic scale beyond any ever seen previously in the Star Wars universe -killed so many Jedi ur head would spin -killed so many subordinates ur head would spin -killed so many Rebel scum ur head would spin -kidnapped his daughter for the first time -tortured his daughter for information -blew up his daughter’s home planet
-KILLED OBI-WAN - HIS FATHER FIGURE (Anakin had no father, so I’m counting this one patricide)
-tried to kill his son for the 1st time -kidnapped his daughter for the second time -kidnapped his daughter’s friends -tortured his daughter’s boyfriend -froze his daughter’s boyfriend in carbonite -held his daughter and company hostage to lure and manipulate his son so he could kidnap him, too -fought his son in a lightsaber duel -cut off his son’s hand -proceeded to tell his son he was his father at a desperate, vulnerable moment -tried to manipulate his son to the Dark Side -kidnapped his son again -took his son to the most evil, vile man to have ever lived - Palpatine -fought his son again in a light saber duel -tried to manipulate his son to the Dark Side again at threat of death
There’s more from old and new EU, but I’m pretty tired… and anyway, I think it’s pretty clear what the difference is. I’m not sure how people who’ve watched this saga even think Kylo’s crimes compare to Vader’s. And, especially when you dig into EU stuff, it’s even MORE appalling what Vader has done.
honestly the yoda/dooku/jinn/kenobi/skywalker/tano dynasty is like?? disproportionately influential to the galaxy at large compared to other dynasties? Like you’ve got
the freakin GRAND MASTER OF THE JEDI ORDER (who will later help train the last jedi)
a Sith Lord who is the face of the Separatist movement
a maverick/pain in the council’s collective butts who FINDS THE CHOSEN ONE AND BRINGS HIM TO THE JEDI
a Sith-killing famous Jedi General/Councilmaster who told the council about the clones and didn’t tell them about his apprentice’s girlfriend, watched over their last hope
THE ACTUAL CHOSEN ONE, the Hero with No Fear who was manipulated for years into falling to the dark side and helping to destroy the Order, terrorized the galaxy as the Emperor’s enforcer, slam dunked the old hag off a cliff #iconic
a teenage soldier who is a integral part of many battles, when the jedi turn their backs on her and then die she helps people instead of just hiding (which would be safer), as FULCRUM basically is Rebel Intelligence, took on darth freakin’ vader so kanan and ezra could escape
the only other dynasty that could even possibly compete with this is windu/billaba/jarrus (dume)/bridger