I have been following this “hydra cap” story for almost a year now and need to express somethings I feel are important. Yeah it’s been a year since I posted the first image and it has spread like wild fire. Thanks to those who have who boosted our message as comic fans.
First off whilst Spencer insists they (Hydra) are not Nazis, and refers to a fairly recent retcon that establishes Hydra as predating the Nazis by thousands of years, they still look and act surprisingly like Nazis.
Lets look at some facts that ‘people who actually read comics’ will already know:
In ‘Civil War II: The Oath’, Rogers dreams of his ideal Hydra future. In that future we have the following:
1) Classrooms of entirely white, ayrian children swearing allegiance in a manner worryingly similar to that of the Hitler youth.
2) A group of white ayrian children chasing a black mutant child down an alley to a surely horrible fate. The kids positively gleam white, which is surely an intentional act of symbolism.
3) A concentration camp full of people who are ‘different’
4) A rally that looks like the mirror image of the Nuremburg rallies.
If Spencer wants to insist that Hydra are not ‘Nazis’, then maybe he shouldnt use quite so much Nazi symbolism and visual references? Nope not possible for him to do because it’s easier to destroy a legacy with shock value
Oh yeah, 100 bucks to anyone who can find a non-white Hydra agent in any of Nick Spencers stuff. You wont - thats the safest 100 bucks on the planet.
So what were left with is a fascist organisation that believes in power by force of arms, have ideologies of racial superiority, indoctrinate their youth, imprison and exterminate anyone who is different, and allow open oppression of any person who doesnt fit that mold.
Sound like a bunch of people we know?
Whether people admit it or not, lets not pretend that Hydra Cap’s organization is not as evil and dispicable as the worst Nazis.
Spencer’s constant hat wringing that they arent that offends me the most. He fucked up - he didnt think the implications of his story through, now people are calling him on it and instead of owning it, hes trying to mitigate it and lie. (And on top of it he brags and makes jokes about destroying a character just to pay himself on the back like he’s near as good of a writer as his predecessors )
The ending to the FCBD secret empire issue? I’ll spoil it here for those not knowing already. HYDRA CAP PICKS UP THOR’S HAMMER AS DEAD AND INJURED SUPERHEROES LAY AT HIS FEET! This was blatantly placed into the book to dispell the people saying Cap can’t be evil because he’s worthy to pick up the hammer. without a doubt this alone not only shakes cap’s history but Thor’s as well . Does it imply the hammer an evil racist Nazi as well? Does it imply Thor is? Why not Nick Spencer’s writing seems to indicate all Caucasians as racists.
I dont like this story in principle anymore than any other critic - but primarily I dislike it because I’m sick of seeing my heroes acting like a bunch of fucking dicks all of the time and fighting each other instead of the real villains, and I dont see a way out of this for Steve Rogers that doesnt involve the use of another tired old comic book trope - probably a heroic and temporary 'death’, followed by another replacement Cap arc, followed by another 'triumphant return’ - or worse - the whole thing gets cosmic cubed, because of course nothing important happens to Rogers without a cosmic cube.
So, to back up a bit, even if we go with the idea that Hydra predates Nazism, then at *best* they’re a group who saw the Nazi ideology and said “Hey, we can work with this.”
As its a comic, if doesnt reference the movies at all, the movies should not be ignored.
Even if you come at it from the movies which have a wider audience than the comics, it sure looks like Hydra has Nazi roots or at least affiliation. The Red Skull is in Nazi uniform and allied with Hitler. Agents of Shield digs into the deeper historical root but you can’t unring a bell
That’s still pretty fucking damning.
That said, Marvel should also be aware and expect that people who consume their other media will have heard about this story and are going to come to their own conclusions perhaps on what they have seen in the film.
If you want to court mainstream media attention - as Marvel were soooooo happy to do at the beginning of this story - the price of that is mainstream media scrutiny. It’s something I am shocked Disney as a company would allow, though they are pushing to fix it with Generations the damage is done.
Axel Alonso, Nick Spencer, anyone who thought this was a good idea should be fired. and though it should not need saying; NO we should not send them death threats as this makes them think what they are doing is a good thing. Spencer seems to live off the hate he gets. Message marvel demanding his job be taken. His actions are no different than the artist that snuck antisemitic messages into X-men gold #1 . Racism is racism no matter what. Nick Spencer shouldn’t be able to hide behind the double standard he loves to use as a cop out when people criticise his writings.
And now they want to have comic shop employees dress as Hydra agents on free comic book day…. -sigh- PLEASE on free comic book day 2017 please discourage people from picking up the free marvel comics. Mostly do not pick up the secret empire issue. Show Marvel we don’t want this kind of trash.
Repost if you like or add your opinions, I’m interested in what others think about it.
Greg Pak was saying McK and I should do a Dazzler comic on twitter earlier.
It reminded me of something.
When we were doing PHONOGRAM, we were often asked in interviews about what superhero work we wanted to do. Our standard answer was Dazzler, not as we really wanted to specifically, but because we wanted to talk about our creator owned books in interviews. It was a standard answer that got a laugh, and to get back to trying to make people interested in our desperately uninteresting indie book.
However, the problem with writers is that if you even say things enough near them, they’ll find themselves thinking about it on some level. And one day I realised I had an idea for a Dazzler story.
And then you find yourself just writing them down, to get them out of your head. I did it for this story, and put it in a folder alongside such masterworks as ROBIN HOOD VERSUS PREDATOR, and expected to never touch it again. I’m not working for Marvel, and I wasn’t trying to court them. I had uninteresting indie books to try and sell.
Then Fraction mentions to me that Marvel may be looking for a Dazzler mini. I smile, polish it up a bit and lob it at Axel and Nick.
It didn’t go anywhere for reasons that will become immediately obvious - in part that Attilan had just moved off the moon, in part that it was patently apeshit - but I’m still fond of it in many ways. There’s at least two jokes I like in it a lot - the implicit one that it’s a PROG vs DISCO story set on the Dark Side of the Moon and the other which you’ll probably guess, as I mention it twice.
And on a more practical level, people do ask me what one of my synopsis/pitches look like. This is a very early version, obviously, but may be interesting for that too.
Anyway - here’s what 2007 era Gillen was thinking about the Disco Dazzler…