A lot of people are talking about the possibility that we are going to see multiple aus in season 13, not just the one from the finale.
If that’s the case, I really want there to be an episode in which team free will come across a universe where Cas wasn’t the angel to get to Dean in hell first. Instead, Dean was saved by a different angel (maybe Uriel).
Of course, that angel wouldn’t have Cas’s inclinatin towards free will and rebellion and they certainly wouldn’t have fallen in love with Dean.
Now think of all the times Cas was vital to saving the world - his first rebellion in the greenroom, the holyfire-molotow-cocktail, Raphael’s plans to start the the Apocalypse- and then think of all the times the Winvchester’s would have been dead without Castiel. That alternative universe would be as much of a barren wasteland as the one where Dean and Sam were never born because the world would have ended at least ten times over. Let Cas see this and let Dean and Sam see his reaction!
Because Cas doesn’t just help. He’s a goddamn hero!
Now I wonder if they plan on making it that Cas actually new what was going to happen to him because of what the nephilim showed him. That would be an interesting scene to have with Dean finding out Cas went through with it despite that outcome, just for "paradise" which was probably just Dean and Sam safe and not hunting honestly lol.
I honestly do not think so.
Because like Mary trying to push her personal idea of what her boys should want (a world free of monsters where they don’t have to hunt) on them despite them actively not wanting that for themselves, I think Cas doesn’t actually want that idea of Jack’s paradise, and he damn well knows DEAN doesn’t want that. He’s known Dean doesn’t want that for years.
So why was Cas convinced by Jack’s “vision of the future?”
BECAUSE RIGHT NOW CAS DOESN’T REALLY HAVE A CHOICE IN THE MATTER.
Seriously, the only way any of this makes sense is if Cas is actively not making his own choices right now.
There’s a lot of things at play right now. The idea of faith vs free will is primary among them. Peace and freedom, you can’t have both, and Dean would pick freedom every damn time. Cas… didn’t. Not because that’s not what he would choose if GIVEN a choice, but Jack took his choice away with one touch in 12.19.
Exactly like the twig dolls in 12.20– still “themselves” except when needed by the witch who controlled them. And very UNLIKE what Mary became under the MoL’s brainwashing, where they’d entirely locked who she was inside a little box where she hid herself away because it was easier than to face what they’d turned her into.
So when it comes to small things (like buying a ridiculous amount of diapers for a kid who will never be a baby, or reading 74 books on childrearing, or taking a doula class) he’s still “himself,” but when it comes to the BIG THINGS (like the weird rift in space/time that Jack opened up for some reason), he’s definitely not reacting the way “regular Cas” would– to the degree that I’ve seen theories floating around that it must be some AU Cas who came back through the rift and not even “our Cas” at all.
But we don’t need that sort of ridiculous outlandish (and utterly narratively pointless) theory to explain this behavior at all… if we all just accept that Jack has been sock puppeting Cas since 12.19.
Which is the entire POINT of this whole freaking arc.
Sorry… it’s just… to me, none of it makes any sense if Cas has CHOSEN to do ANY of this.
He stumbled over the recollection of that initial “vision” when Kelly asked him to tell her about it again in order to comfort herself. Like it didn’t feel real anymore, and he needed to convince himself of it again. Kelly took his hand again (like she did in 12.19, which we then saw a flashback to, which looked like Cas being completely “possessed” down to the glowy yellow eyes), as if enforcing that “vision.”
ONE TOUCH of the nephilim and Cas pulls a 180 on EVERYTHING he was working for, his entire motivation to spare Dean from having to kill the nephilim switching over to doing everything in his power to save the nephilim, without even trying to explain it to Dean– the person he’d previously cited as the one he’d been sacrificing everything else for…
I mean… gah. Sorry. I just don’t see where they’re going with this AT ALL if Cas isn’t being controlled (at least to a degree, like the twig people) by Jack.
Sorry, this has sort of evolved into a major pet peeve of mine over the last few days… :P
What do you say to people who say the show is, has been, and will ultimately be about the brothers? I disagree, but idk how to convince my friend this. I'd like to say the show would have failed at this point without Cas and other characters, but I don't really have stats to back that up...
I mean…that was the premise, but the show fundamentally changed when Cas came in. And the show wouldn’t survive without him…Or Bobby or Crowley or any of the other characters. It’s the Brother’s story but it would have ended long ago without others in it.
This picture is from behind the scenes for a Season 13 promo… this isn’t our Cas. Misha said at JIBcon that he was concerned what this death would do to Castiel. How it would affect him… what if Lucifer killed OUR Cas and the Cas here is from the AU? Why would they put Misha/Castiel in a dark trenchcoat? To me, the coat symbolizes Castiel’s soul… the fact that it’s black makes my heart hurt.
I like to think Dean gave him the mixtape and he was like "this is a wonderful precious thing. I will keep it over my heart at all times." And therefore never listened to it; because then he might be separated from his precious Dean artifact.
Its entirely possible nonny. We know for certain that he carried it in the inside pocket of his coat next to his heart. It does call into question why he would have ever thought to return it to Dean if he hadn’t yet listened to it but I know for sure that Cas would have cherished owning that mixtape even if he wasn’t actually aware at first that it was a gift that he gets to keep.
Perhaps once he realised it was a gift and his to keep, THEN he would have been like “this is staying right here by my heart so I can cherish it always” and at that point yeah I can see him maybe not listening to it so often because after all we know that classic rock isn’t Cas’s favourite kind of music… he likes pop and rap and that kind of stuff (which is hilarious lets be honest - especially given the kind of reaction Dean has to it) so Led Zeppelin really isn’t to Cas’s taste. But of course he cherishes it anyway because it was given to him by DEAN.
Is our Cas really dead and misha will just return for an au version of Cas? Mark p also tweeted to someone being upset about Cas to remember that there is an alternative universe
Correct me if I’m wrong because I’m totally out of the loop 1000% on all the wild speculation that’s followed but I assume they’re not supposed to tell us Cas would come back because spoilers, but then Jared went and blurted a thing at JIB anyway which sounds like things will be as normal as ever by the middle of the next season, so… Those kind of tweets are deliberate can’t tell you anything misdirection, and we’ve got to assume if Misha’s involved in a freakin’ Scooby Doo episode things are going to be on some level of as normal as things ever get.
(I’m running this by Mittens first since she’s been in the loop)
I'm starting to think that wasn't the real Cas and our Cas is still stuck in the alternate universe
Well there has certainly been a lot of speculation about this going around. It is of course a possibility.
But I got some very big questions about that if they go down this route.
1. If the Winchesters were never born, then why would Cas have needed to come to earth and take Jimmy as a vessel?
2. Even if he DID take Jimmy as a vessel, how would he have picked the outfit that OUR Cas wears since that was the outfit he chose himself when he stole the grace in season 9?
3. If that WAS an au Cas, why would he have gone after Lucifer? Wouldn’t he have stood back to let Michael fight him? Surely he would have been more confused and had questions rather than just go for him?
4. Even if say for instance that au Cas found our Cas, zapped him unconscious and stole his clothes… what are the motivations for doing that? Why would he change clothes with him?
Basically there is absolutely no logical reason why au Cas would be wearing the exact same outfit as our Cas. Therefore I think it is unlikely that an au Cas died.
Have some *wild* speculation:
Something that has been bothering me is how Cas was back to talking about ‘paradise’ and ‘peace’ in the future. Just like his season 4 self prior to Dean’s big speech which caused Cas’s original fall. OUR Cas should most definitely NOT be motivated by this idea of paradise and peace.
SO… What if Baby Jack is able to create some sort of psychic link between Cas and his au counterpart? What if he was somehow influencing Cas by using the motivations and ideals of his au version and through Jacks power ended with them switching consciousness? (like freaky friday style).
When Cas goes to the au world. He sees his au self complete with necklace of human ears or whatever it was but before he can do anything the magic that connects them somehow manages to switch their consciousness’s and au Cas (in our Cas’s body) knocks our Cas out and goes through the portal to check things out. Hence him acting all weird and suspicious and lying to Kelly etc.
Now I did say this was WILD speculation… its not actually what I THINK will happen (I think our Cas is dead and Jack will bring him back because it is the easy option and the most obvious and the least complicated to explain in 13x01 as any ‘au cas’ option would require flashback scenes to show what the audience missed in 12x23 and I can’t see them going for that over Jack coming out the house, realising his protector is dead and being like nope he’s mine I want him back *zapp* and Cas is alive and the season 4 style faith story was Jack factory resetting Cas in a way and using manipulation and a form of brainwashing like i’ve been saying all along. Boom.)
But it makes for some good speculation and also of course, fanfic ideas over hiatus. :P
My Jensen-Misha photo from jibcon8 this morning. I posted this already from the @fandomnatural account I was livetweeting from but thought I would stick it here too. As soon as I can scan a high res version I will do that too.
Background: All I said was, mostly speaking to Jensen, “Given the events of the finale, could you [JA] just give this guy [MC] a hug?” I added to clarify “Like you just got your best friend back.” I didn’t say anything about expressions or how to stand. I actually had been picturing more just a big ol’ happy smooshy hug w both of them smiling, but what they actually did blew me away. What was interesting was seeing them both silently settle on the pose & expression in almost slow motion, like they were both thinking about it. Jensen kept adjusting his face & head angle. That tragic sad frown appeared kinda like he clicked it on, and he then literally adjusted it twice, like “This frown? This one? No, this one,” and his head also started dropping down, and meanwhile Misha was like slowly tilting his head against Jensen’s (which I also had not asked for) and arranging his face into that incredibly touching mournful/resigned look. Misha kept looking at the camera but in Jensen’s final adjustment he dropped his eyes. (Good lord these guys are pros.)
So every nuance of expression & pose is from Jensen & Misha. I think this is Jensen’s real take on how Dean would look if he got to grab onto Cas again. (and I ended up with this weird certainty in my gut that Jensen had just given me a preview of S13)
Why the SPN mixtape scene from 12x19 is screenwriting gold, and should be taught to the next generations of screenwriters everywhere - analysis
20 seconds. Two lines of dialogue, three gestures, a couple more camera angles. Episode 19, season 12 of a genre TV show “Supernatural”. A single strike of screenwriting and cinematic genius. The mixtape scene.
Robert Berens and Meredith Glynn, I bow before you.
This scene should be used as an example for future screenwriters how you can put maximum of meaning into minimal time and dialogue. Should be analyzed and taught at universities everywhere, how to achieve the most using the least. How to write for TV, where you only have less than an hour to built something spectacular.
Let’s just peel off all the layers of these 20 seconds of footage and these 13 words. 13 WORDS.
(Cas knocks, Dean doesn’t say anything. Cas opens the door, apologizes for disturbing Dean in his room, and then takes a cassette tape out of his left inside coat pocket, and puts it on the desk, while tapping the label on it that says “Deans (sic!) top 13 Zepp traxx”.)
Cas: Um, I just wanted to return this.
Dean: It’s a gift. You keep those.
13 tracks. 13 words. The future. So number thirteen is important for the future. I mean, are you trying to tell us something here, writers?
(Dean takes the tape, oustreches his arm, and gives it back to Cas. We see Cas’ hand grabbing the tape, and taking it back.)
That tiny scene is ENORMOUS from the perspective of the narrative and the characterization. Let’s see what we can get out of it. (Prepare yourself: it’s gonna be long. Damn, how much meta can you write based on 20 seconds of television and two lines of dialogue?) (Hint: A lot.)
Imagine the otp move into a haunted ass house and when creepy things start happening person A is like “let’s go see what it is” and Person B is like “I refuse to be a white person at the beginning of a horror movie.”