ignorant invincibility

Undertale/MOTHER Final Boss parallels: homages and coincidences

(Edit: Fixed the images! Whoops)

Hi people of tumblr! my name is crit and for the most part i am just some dude using tumblr, but i am also a huge fan of Undertale! And in my plays of Undertale I’ve noticed some striking parallels between several of Undertale’s “final” bosses (not all of which are decidedly the last one, of course) and bosses in similar positions in the MOTHER games! So here I am making a post about them.

This is of course endgame spoilers for Undertale, so I’m putting them under this here readmore.

Keep reading


“The only winning move is not to play.” -W.O.P.R. (Wargames, 1983)

Condensed version of one of Undertale’s best scenes. Sans was willing to as a last resort, spend eternity waiting, watching you, stuck in a locked battle between your soul and his own. To protect what little remains after your genocidal rampage, to prevent you from ever resetting and trying this again, he sacrifices himself to a self made hell, the only way to keep you in that hell too.

The ending to this fight and the ending of Wargames is very similar. In Wargames they convince the super computer not to launch the nuclear missiles by forcing it to play tictactoe against itself, resulting in an impossible game because no matter what strategies it uses, it will end up in a draw. The computer runs simulations having learned the futility and concept of mutually assured destruction, and finds that all strategies of starting a thermonuclear world war result in no winners, and thus finds Thermonuclear war “a strange game”, with the only winning move being not to play, quitting the game and offering to play chess instead.

In Undertale, it ends the other way, Sans tries to frustrate and trick the player/ to trick Chara to give up and stop. He attacked first before you can, ignores invincibility frames, uses KARMA toxin, attacked while you are in the menu, dodges your attacks, even if you do a critical hit, and he doesn’t end his turn after a set amount of time. He doesn’t teach Chara that the only winning move is not to play, he teaches him how to break the games rules and cheat, so when Sans dodges the attack, he is caught off guard when Chara attacks again a second time in one turn while he is talking and is unable to dodge it. He teaches Chara how he can attack even when the player doesn’t push the button, you can only hit fight once but he will still do the second attack, and you don’t have control over whether he attacks at that point. He teaches Chara that he can attack while the enemy is still trying to speak, and that he can attack over and over, even if one attack has already killed them, as demonstrated on Asgore and Flowey.

It’s two sided coin to these strategy based battles. The only way not to lose is to not play, and the only way to win is to break the rules.

out-of-pc-deactivated20160814  asked:

So when Sans gives you the option to spare him in the genocide route and you accept, he kills you right away. I understand why he would do that, wanting to stop the monster at their most vulnerable moment and all but… Sans knows that your going to come back. He knows how determination works, so wouldn't he realize that even if he kills Chara, they will be back again ( just like all the other times he kills thm in the battle)? Is there a reason he does this instead of letting Chara spare him?

He knows, that’s why he says “if you are really my friend, you won’t come back”

His plan is first to annoy you and frustrate you by killing you over and over, trying “cheating” tactics like dodging, attacking while you are in the menu, pausing the fight with a black screen and no sound, ignoring invincibility frames, and attacks first.

Once he gets tired and his sparing trick fails, he goes to his special attack. Which is never ending his turn. In the end it backfires with Chara taking over and cheating too, by moving the entire battle box down to the fight button, and then when Sans dodges, Chara cheats by attacking a second time, while Sans is talking, before Sans makes his turn.

Chara only learns to cheat because of this, and goes on to attack Asgore while he is talking and before he can figure out and grab the souls.

keeby10  asked:

Have you seen the new Culture Shock about Sans being a revenant?

Yea, it’s interesting, doesn’t explain the face or why only one eye lights up, or the magic powers, or KARMA.
However the remembering stuff isn’t true, sans can’t remember stuff from resets, he just understands the concept and is really good with perception, like he has been trained to the point he can tell how many times he has killed someone by how they react.

You’d think that would be impossible, but watching people on YouTube fight him with facecam on, there is really this same range of emotions and order, and I could sort of tell the first 5 deaths apart, the 6-10 deaths were generally the same reaction, and usually after 10 there was nothing but focus and blank unblinking stares, and lots of silence. Sans does confirm in the game that he can’t tells what has happened and what hasn’t, if you do genocide the first run or genocide before being friends with Sans, he will still claim to think there is an old friend in you, unlike other monsters that will not mention remembering something about you if you have not met them before.
Basically that bit about remembering you being a good person inside and being a friend was a bluff. Sans guessed. He doesn’t know. He even screws up on counting how many battles it’s been at one point, because of how hard it is to guess by your reaction.

Oh, and Sans isn’t super strong. He is really weak, it’s just his attacks have a toxin effect and ignore invincibility frames.