he has a lot of scenes with eli

hi, this is really important ! please dont scroll past. i think its time that the fandom really had a talk about its most toxic abuser… ocelot.

as a mentally ill abuse survivor its incredibly concerning to me to see so many ppl in the mgs fandom blindly supporting and even identifying as the character revolver ocelot… this is not ok. hes canonically a murderer, torturer, an abuser and a RAPIST, and there are many pedophilic undertones in how hes written. maybe a lot of ppl havent actually played the games, and dont know about this content. but im going to write it all out for you and hopefully youll realize that yr supporting rape and abuse by apologizing for the things ocelot does :/

im not even going to focus on all the times ocelot is shown to murder or torture ppl… im sure everyone knows abt that, but i would remind you that hes canonically a sadist who ENJOYS torture.

anyway, lets start with mgs1….

in mgs1, if snake submits to ocelot’s torture, you get a scene where ocelot says hes going to rape meryl:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8cKPrHFLq8
“The torture will stop as I promised… But I’ll take the woman in return. I’ll have my fun with her… before I kill her.”

you might be able to say that this is just a threat and empty words to upset snake (tbh this is really some apologist rape culture stuff to even go there as your first response to this, but i wont even get into that) if not for this later scene in the meryl ending, where meryl heavily implies that she had to endure stuff “worse than” torture:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoXOkAUJUX4&t=43s

S: Meryl… it must have been terrible.
M: It wasn’t that bad. I didn’t give in to the torture.
S: Torture?
M:  … And things even worse than that…

i think its pretty clear in light of what ocelot says in the other clip what things "even worse than that” means….

ive seen some people claim that this isnt in the japanese version of the script, but thats not true. i speak japanese so lets look at the JP version and ill translate as literally as i can.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULOJaSM9xJo&t=16m32s

スネーク: メリル?メリル、大丈夫か? (Meriru? Meriru, daijoubu ka?)
Meryl? Meryl, are you okay?

メリル: 大丈夫か、しか言えないの・・・? (Daijoubu ka, shika ienai no…?)
“Are you okay”? Is that all you can say?

スネーク: メリル、つらい思いをさせた。(Meriru, tsurai omoi wo saseta.)
Meryl… you had a terrible experience.

メリル: いいえ、つらくはなかったわ。奴等の拷問に私、屈しなかった。(Iie, tsuraku wa nakatta wa. Yatsura no goumon ni watashi, kusshinakatta.)
No, it didn’t get that bad. I didn’t give in to their torture.

スネーク: 拷問?(Goumon?)
Torture?

メリル: それ以上のひどいことも・・・。私も闘ってたの、あなたと同じように。(Sore ijou no hidoi koto mo… Watashi mo tatakattetano, anata to onaji you ni.)
And things more cruel than that… I was fighting too, the same as you.

this is pretty much just how it was translated in the english version. its not explicit, she doesnt come out and exactly say I WAS RAPED, but with ocelots rape threat earlier in the game its very clear what she means… ocelot at the very least ordered her to be raped, if not partook in the act himself, which he probably did because he CANONICALLY is a sadist who enjoys torture. yes, ocelot is gay, but you dont have to be attracted to someone to rape them…

heres a scene in mgs3 where ocelot gropes eva without her consent:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5mS_7oIx5Y&t=4m15s
yes, hes touching her breasts because hes trying to figure out who she is and not for gratification….. but it still displays that he has NO CONCERN for eva’s sexual boundaries. thats SEXUAL ASSAULT.

and of course later in this same scene where ocelot proclaims his interest in torture…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5mS_7oIx5Y&t=5m38s

so ocelot is canonically a rapist and a sexual assaulter… thats undeniable. but theres also a lot that implies that ocelot is an abuser, and it doesnt take a lot to conclude that he groomed solid snake and liquid snake for problematic purposes :/

for instance, look at this convo between kaz and ocelot in mgsv where kaz accuses ocelot of getting off on torturing eli, an 11-12 y/o child:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxIjSF_tvRI&t=1m46s

K: Ocelot. You get too many kicks from your “art of interrogation”.
O: It’s not a matter of art. It’s about quick, minimal strokes of psychological warfare. That’s what gets the answers. And it’s the best way to keep both questioner and subject safe. The risks only increase the more an interrogation drags on. At that point, it causes as much pain for the inflicter as the inflicted.
K: Hmph. Like I said, too many kicks.

obviously kaz is far from an unbiased observer here, but we know ocelot. it’s not at all unreasonable that he’d think this. whats most notable about this is that ocelot doesnt even deny the accusation… he goes on and on abt how his method is the best and does say he wont “go overboard”, but he doesnt actually contradict kaz’s accusation that he’d get off on torturing a child :/

then later on when ocelot finally does interrogate eli, the way he touches him is very uncomfortable:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMiO7vVStAQ&t=30s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMiO7vVStAQ&t=52s

what reason does ocelot have to violate elis personal space like this? its not explicitly sexual but in light of all his other behaviors its very questionable…

theres more stuff that ocelot does, too, thats not so easy to point out w specific clips. like the fact that ocelot spends the entirety of mgsv abusing kaz.

i think its pretty clear that ocelot has romantic feelings for big boss (he outright says so here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-KQOMGsf0M&t=4m03s, plus lots of other things to support it, im sure i dont have to dig that up to convince ppl on tumblr at least lol), but its not so obvious that big boss ever reciprocated them. imo, he didnt… theres really no point where big boss is shown having any feelings like that for ocelot. i think this is a lot clearer in the japanese version, the english version actually seems to have made their relationship MORE familiar. for example, big boss actually never calls ocelot adam in the truth tapes… he calls him “junior” (furigana over “son of the boss”). i sure hope big boss wouldnt call his lover “junior”….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6YHwDwR3Uo&t=3m51s

オセ:では……ジョン。9年間忘れたことはなかったが私はしばらくあなたを忘れます。(Dewa… John. Kyuunen kan wasureta koto wa nakatta ga watashi wa shibaraku anata wo wasuremasu.)
Well… John. I haven’t forgotten you in nine years, but I will forget you soon.
ボス:ザ・ボスの息子(ジュニア)。また頼む。(Junia. Mata tanomu.)
Junior… I’ll rely on you again.

also something i think that backs me up is how ocelot speaks to bb in these tapes… he uses very polite and formal language with him. he doesnt speak like this anywhere else in the game, not even to venom… he uses ore pronouns and casual/masculine speech usually. but when talking to bb it totally changes. he uses masu form, deferential language, and watashi, which is very formal/feminine for a male character to say. it’s very respectful but also not intimate. this is the way you talk to a stranger or your superior. he clearly respects big boss, but doesnt consider himself to have the right to use familiar speech with him. i think its really unlikely that a male character would be written in japanese speaking to his lover this way…

so, if ocelot is in love with big boss, but big boss doesnt return his feelings, i think this speaks a lot to the subtext of his behavior in the games. we know that despite this ocelot dedicates his whole life to bb… he even dies for him… so i think that really sheds some light on what he does to kaz in mgsv.

theres a lot more evidence that bb had a more intimate relationship w kaz (see: the entire sauna tape, date with kaz… basically, the whole of peace walker), and i think its clear that ocelot was jealous. he didnt overtly attack or insult kaz but thats exactly his MO… long manipulative conspiracies meant to take people down without them even realizing.

if you look at all of their interactions theres a revealing pattern in how ocelot speaks to kaz. he more or less does everything he can to undermine kaz in front of bb (venom). he contradicts kaz constantly, and sets himself up as the “rational voice” always. he negs kaz for being “too emotional”. this really is basically gaslighting… he puts up a civil front but in everything he says and does hes undermining kazs authority and the validity of his emotions. he’s trying to make kaz feel hysterical and invalid and worthless. its abusive.

i have no doubt that ocelot was a big factor in withholding the truth about v from kaz, too. the way he speaks to kaz in their post-credits scene, he seems really self-satisfied hearing how devastated kaz is to learn the truth. almost like he’s gloating. he knew that hiding it and then telling kaz later would totally destroy bb and kaz’s relationship, and he enjoyed doing it. he took away everything that kaz had and left him emotionally destroyed. just killing kaz wasnt enough, that’s how petty and vindictive and sick ocelot is.

lets not forget about the fact that ocelot was involved in les enfants terribles. in light of everything else ocelot does i find this so suspect. i dont think its really a reach to conclude that he had an ulterior motive getting involved in that project. big boss didnt return his feelings, but what if he could groom david or eli to?

in the post-credits scene with kaz https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziCAzVuyJX0 ocelot more or less says that hes going to spend the rest of his life watching over david and eli. ocelot probably had a lot more involvement in eli’s life that we never saw but thats a lot of speculation… there is one concrete thing that proves ocelot was probably attracted to bb’s sons though. in mgs4, during the final fight, where he kisses snake: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ7zCUeEN_M&t=47s

and before you say that this is liquid ocelot and not ocelot, this kiss scene can ONLY trigger in the part of the liquid ocelot fight where it calls back to mgs3 and ocelot is coming back to himself. AFTER he’s been injecting himself with nanomachine suppressors and undoing the liquid brainwashing. he ONLY wants to kiss solid snake after his identity returns…

so, you dont think its a little bit messed up that this man participated in a project to clone a man who hes canonically attracted to… and then displays attraction to his children too??? ocelot helped make david and eli. he’s basically one of his parents. he helped raise them, directly and later indirectly. how is this not child grooming? ocelot loved big boss, but was rejected by big boss, then involved himself in a science experiment to clone him, then spent the rest of his life watching over and shaping the lives of these kids. umm….

i mean, think about it… what do you think ocelot got out of les enfants terribles? why would ocelot, who is otherwise so loyal to big boss that he would and does die for him, betray him like that?

kind of problematic, huh. :/

ocelot tortured people. he murdered people. he raped meryl, and probably others too. he destroyed kaz’s life out of jealousy. i think ocelot probably abused liquid, and likely solidus too.  

i think ocelot is an interesting character… but hes a really bad person. i think if you look at all of this and try to defend him or even identify AS him… you kinda need to take a look at yourself imo. either you’re claiming that you too are a murderer, a sadist, a rapist, and an abuser, or you’re an apologist, erasing every horrible thing that ocelot did. whats wrong with you?

The killer is Kieran I’m telling ya.

-Haley was trying suck dick so we know it’s a man (or a man accomplice only god knows)

-He suddenly showed up at the park with Em, Noah and Audrey after the killer “disappeared”, casually shows up in a lot of crime scenes too.

-Hasn’t been in risk not even ONCE, not even threats.

-In the beggining of the last episode they show the killer’s filming when he broke into Emma’s house , and when Kieran was at Eli’s room the way he filmed was A LOT similar

-How comes he just casually knows that whatever Eli was hiding it was under his bed in that exact spot? As far as we know he could have hide it all there himself.

- If Eli was worried that Kieran was going to find anythig he would’ve done something.

-If anyone has been looking suspiciously at Kieran lately it’s Eli.

-We don’t know if Emma could also have told him the way into the house anyway, since it’s her bf.

-He came up with Brooke’s dad murder at the last minute. Let me explain…

1) He heard his aunt and Eli’s conversation on the major being a fraud and the stolen documents.

2)After that he goes out, Em and Audrey are talking, then he says “maybe he’s using the pig farm as a hidedown” aka “maybe you should go look to see if that’s what’s going on” He wanted that. An open opportunity specially with the pictures, and it works, he gets Emma’s text.

3) Texts the major, plans the meetup, kills him. He KNOWS both girls will go look.

Finally 4) KIERAN was the one who called Emma’s mother to tell her they were in the farm, most likely knowing that she would get concerned, tell the sheriff, and then have the two of them to be found at the crime scene alone.

oh btw he 5) arrived there “worried” at the last moment. Huh

That video was probably already done tho, he just decided to make it more believable, unless he did it real fast

-If I remember Kieran moved to Lakewood in the first episodes and, assuming that, since that’s when the killings started, that’s when Piper did too.

-He was with Nina????

-Somebody mentioned about the killer’s boots matching Kieran’s? I didn’t pay attention to Kieran’s boots but take that in count

I’m just sayin’

Still don’t know WHY tho

But I got Piper right last season so I’m trusting myself