There’s a bit at the end of the series where the two of them are just alone in an elevator together and they’re looking at each other and we didn’t know what it was gonna be, we didn’t know what was gonna happen, we didn’t know what it was gonna mean, but it definitely means something -Jon Bernthal
Is there a type of torture that includes amputation? Specifically for the purpose of making the victim compliant w the torturer's beliefs/ actions? Also, what types of tortures work best w vulnerable children who have already witnessed emotional/physical trauma for previously mentioned reasons? (btw the torturers are a religion-based cult group) Thank you so much, have a wonderful day/night :)
Torture does not make the victim ‘compliant’ in any sense.
It may render a victim
unable to physically resist but to me those are different things. 'Compliance’
to me implies cooperation, it implies that the victim 'agrees’ to go along with
what the torturer wants. The evidence we have suggests this is incredibly rare.
There was a time in France when it was legal to use torture to force
confessions in certain cases. Because of this we now have a valuable set of
statistical data about how 'good’ torture is at forcing people to confess.
The French average was around 10%.
Under torture up to 90% of people will
not comply with their torturer long enough to sign their own name.
Anecdotal accounts bear this out too. Victims commonly report extreme
antagonism to their torturers. They report anger, hatred, aggression and
generally seem to be much more strongly opposed to their torturer and any
ideals or groups the torturer may stand for than they were before torture.
Torture does the opposite of making people 'compliant’. It makes people angry,
stubborn, rebellious and generally much more inclined to resist in any way they
I think you really need to rethink the way you’re intending to use torture in
your story. Because if an essential part of it is that torture makes victims
'compliant’ then that’s not only inaccurate but that’s a trope that’s used to justify torture. Specifically it’s used to
justify torture in prisons, schools and 'rough neighbourhoods’.
Torture does not work.
It’s possible that I’m not interpreting the ask correctly, more detail of the
story, what you intend to do with the characters, the setting, time and
country, would have helped.
Torture does not work.
There is no way to
force anyone to abandon or go against their strongly held beliefs.
There is no way to
reliably force agreement or compliance from another human being.
What you are planning to write is an unrealistic justification
In cases like this I
either refuse to give any further help or suggest drastic rewrites changing the
entire premise and structure of the story. This blog was set up largely to
combat and prevent fictional justifications of torture.
In the scenario you’ve
outlined I think the easiest way to change it would be to remove torture in the
cult context entirely.
You are talking about
vulnerable children. The easiest way to get child to 'comply’ is to give them a
positive support structure, praise and security. In essence the way adults get
children to obey them is by showing the child love.
Take torture out of the
story. The only thing you do by including torture is turn your story into an
unrealistic justification for very real atrocities.
Make your villains
kind. Show them taking in these poor children and caring for them. Make them
the perfect, loving, affectionate parental figures these children need.
And then when
the cult wants the children to do something awful show them struggling. Show
how much they want to make their adoptive parents happy.
Show the children
trying to justify their parents crimes to themselves, telling themselves that
the victims must have been bad people, they must have 'deserved’ it, there must
have been a reason- Show the children bending over backwards to avoid thinking
their parents could be wrong.
It’s not brainwashing.
It’s not 'conditioning’. There is no cruelty and no trick.
We are all capable of
doing or supporting awful things in the name of the people we love.
If you want control, if
you want to write kids witnessing and doing awful things then you need the
villains to be kind to those children. You need them to praise and support and
love those children.
That will make taking them from the cult extremely hard. The chances are they
won’t want to leave. They will probably totally and honestly believe that their
only chance of love, self worth and security is with the cult and the awful
people who are part of it. They may have been taught that people outside the
cult do worse things to each other.
That’s the best I can suggest.
For information on how real people respond to torture and how it cements
antagonism I’d suggest taking a look at my post on Fela
Kuti. The founder of Afro-beat music was tortured by security forces for
decades and his death was almost certainly caused by complications due to
prolonged, repeated torture.
When security forces murdered his mother Fela responded by
leading her funeral procession past one of the biggest barracks in the country
and leaving her coffin on the steps. He wrote two songs about that particular attack.
I’m sorry if this is coming across as harsh but I wouldn’t be running this blog if I did not care very deeply about survivors of torture. They are not weak. They are not broken. They are not at fault for what they suffered.
And the more I read the more it seems that the Fela Kuti’s of this world are not the exception. They are the norm.
Minor’s Campaign to Slander Moderator -- The Origin Story
@okiecloverisanincel, @gaydrienagreste, @pleasestopclover – since all three of you have me blocked, let’s go through this bit-by-bit.
NSFW channels require a “I understand this is mature content” click, and at this point, we did have the channel locked with a special role called “Shouldn’t Fuck This”. GaylordTJ, known as “gaydrienagreste” on Tumblr, KNOWINGLY CLICKED ON A NSFW CHANNEL DESPITE BEING A MINOR, AND LIED TO A MODERATOR TO OBTAIN THE ROLE.
17, 15 – still underage, perfectly right to remove your access. It was stated right in the rules you had to be 18+.
Notice that “Draw Me Like a French Dio” isn’t me. That person is a known troll who gets a kick out of posting cringy things in nsfw, to which we all react as “AFO!” / “XD” / “OH GOD WHY”. And we can pull up hundreds of examples of that by this point. They have never once actually posted real pedophilic art or real pornography.
Look at me! Being a moderator, revoking NSFW access from a minor! Oh, no! From a channel that’s semi-trolling, semi-helping artists and writers convey sexual things accurately where minors shouldn’t be!
You didn’t get a response after sending 10+ nasty anons AND nasty name-linked items. Hmm. I owe you a response on tiny plot points when you choose to ignore the big picture of your actions – attempting to bully someone out of a fandom, simply because you couldn’t see lewds?
Did I not, in these screenshots, EXPLICITLY tell one of the people involved in all the call-outs that none of the stuff in NSFW is posted genuinely way before this whole thing happened and they were more than happy to drive the outrage train? Like anyone with a semblance of self-control and responsibility would?
Can I just say something about my reblog/response?
I need to know something…
Please tell me I’m not a bad person for thinking this. Please tell me I’m not alone. i feel like I am. People seem to find comfort in this but I just don’t and can’t. But I wonder if I should. I see them and think ‘why doesn’t this make me feel better?’. Does that make me terrible? Am I alone in this?
Please say I’m not. Someone, please tell me I’m not.
Also, @therealjacksepticeye if you see this I have to say that my response was nothing against you at all, I know you’re a lovely person who just wants to help people and make them feel better. You’ve done that for me many times over. Just not this one time, and that’s down to you not me. I hope you don’t take this personally and hate me. Please don’t. I still love you Jack <3