OFC “pride” is a big theme in the development of Túrin’s character in the CoH, but I think it is a bit more complex than that

Túrin’s character goes a LONG arc where his pride takes several blows until in Brethil almost nothing is left of it… Its been a long time since I wrote for this book so I’m a little confused, but roughly I’d put things like this:

1. Túrin among the outlaws/ Amon Rudh > Túrin takes pride in himself, looks for a commanding/ruling position over others

2. Túrin among the elves/ Nargothrond > Not a lot of pride in his own person, but collective pride for the strength of his own people and of Nargothrond/ those who fight against Morgoth, doesn’t specifically look for a ruling position but gets one anyway and is apparently clueless to how he’s mining Orodreth’s authority (everyone is apparently lmao)

3. Túrin among the brethilians / Ephel Brandir > No pride left, obeys other people and keeps to himself; when confronted with Glaurung’s coming, has no doubts he can fail and end up dead, and so devises an escape for the rest of the population 

(Shout out to Adenydd bc this was something that we rationalized better while talking between ourselves and I thiiiiink the original concept is hers)

adenydd replied to your post: Let’s talk about Nimloth for a moment

There’s nothing in WotJ or PoMe. Now that you mention it, it wouldn’t surprise me if Chris T knocked her off because he can (“tying up loose ends”)

A surviving queen is not a loose end, Christopher!!!

I really do think it’s thematically brilliant if Nimloth survives also. Then we have a king of the Noldor and prince of the Sindar ruling in Balar, and a queen of the Sindar and princess of the Noldor in Sirion. Beautifully symmetrical and nicely symbolic of how much these two people really have for all intents and purposes become almost one at the end.

(Also, it may just be me looking at two marginalized but powerful women whose children conveniently get married and seeing Elizabeth Woodville and Margaret Beaufort conspiring to start the House of Tudor. I’ve always thought Earendil and Elwing were at least partially politically motivated; now I suddenly see it even more.)

squirrelwrangler replied to your post: Let’s talk about Nimloth for a moment

I like Nimloth surviving as well (except then she’d die in the attack on Sirion). I also really like the idea of her killing one of the seven. Sure this surprises no one. (Ugh, her and Finduilas and these other ladies I just want happy AUs)

I love the Feanorians and I enjoy the thought too! Dior can get Celegorm and Nimloth can get Curufin. Mostly because women should not be sitting around helplessly in the middle of a battle. I think the word revisionism gets thrown around a bit more than it should in this fandom, but this is one of the places where I will 100% side with LaCE over what’s presented in the Silmarillion. Because we’ve been erasing women from the history of war in the real world for centuries, and it makes far more sense that they were erased in the Silmarillion as well than that they were sitting around docilely waiting to be killed.

But yeah, Nimloth and Finduilas do need happy AUs. But then so does everyone else. =(

awildellethappears replied to your post: Let’s talk about Nimloth for a moment

I loved this when I first read it, but there isn’t that much to assume her survival either… iirc she is completely invisible in most other texts, and Elwing is usually saved by servants (LAoB, BoLT II).

I do think that one note where she very explicitly survives should outweigh all of the cases where she’s invisible, though. You could go by the Silmarillion just because it’s the Silmarillion, I suppose, but if the one time that Tolkien actually did remember about her, he said that she survived (at least until Sirion)… I don’t know. The Tale of Years is late work compared to LAoB and BoLT, so I’d think that a clear note there should take precedence over earlier silence.

adenydd  asked:

Any ideas regarding population size and ethnic breakdown around Tol Sirion? Surely there would have been small villages or population centers in the vicinity of the tower -- not only for soldiers, but also civilians making a living supplying food, clothes, etc. to the local defense.

Oooh, yes. Be warned, though, that this is almost entirely headcanon. 

I read the text as suggesting that Ivrin and the surrounding area were probably the safest place to be in Beleriand - outside of the Falas and Doriath - between Morgoth’s first assault and the arrival of the Noldor.

The Ered Wethrin are right there, with the attendant cave systems where the Sindar can withdraw for safety from roaming orcs; the springs are protected by Ulmo. This is where Fingolfin chooses to hold the Mereth Aderthad, presumably because there’s a significant Sindar population in the area (it’s reunion with their sundered kin the Sindar that the feast was intended to celebrate, not reunion with their closer kin the Feanorians, who I imagine everyone was quite happy to see move halfway across the continent.) 

So I imagine that the area directly south of Tol Sirion had a large native Sindar population, well-versed in navigating the rivers for safety, for food, and for trade. They would not have lived in villages or permanent settlements, and any that existed before Morgoth were probably destroyed during the brief occupation of Beleriand by orcs.

One possible exception: I imagine some near-permanent, or at least recurring, settlements by the pools of Ivrin themselves.

Of the Noldor less personally wedded to one particular leader, northern Nargothrond seems to be the near-perfect place to settle; far enough north to play a significant role in the war

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heget’s Silmarillion Sigil Set

your daily dose, (37/?)

Disclaimer: Here is a blend of Original Tolkien creations (aka my best efforts at recreating the author’s drawing), modifications on the original, and designs completely from cloth.

Please credit if use.

In order:

Morwen Eledhwen, Nienor Níniel

Previous Entries:

  • HERE is the master-list.


adenydd requested Túrin’s mother and sister, and as I had already made a personal sigil for Turambar himself and a few other Edain, aside from the canon device for Beren, I thought it high time to give a few of the mortal ladies a special sigil. And both of the are important enough socially and to the plot to justify it. Also, follower request, so of course I would attempt it. 

  • Morwen - she was beautiful enough to earn the title Elfsheen, but also touchy with inner steel strength and pride. I had some art nouveau roses set aside and thought Morwen would be a perfect match. Made sure to give the roses large and pointy thorns. The green, gray, and red all come from either the Hador or Bëor sigil, as Morwen was born of one tribe and married into the other. The emphasis on circles is also a carry-over from the Bëor sigil. 
  • If Morwen had red roses, then Nienor got white. And I can justify my arbitrariness by pointing out that the ‘Lay of Leithian’ mentions white roses growing in Neldoreth, and Nienor does spend time in that area. Plus white roses seem to be something the ties into Nienna the Vala of grief and winter. (That white roses are also symbols of remembrance, weddings, purity, innocence, and new beginnings…) Same for the use of blue-grays. While based heavily on her mother’s sigil, Nienor’s device also matches that for Túrin with the red rays on gold. And the dragon scale pattern - Glaurung has to be there somehow. The spears are from Hador (and Tuor).

adenydd  asked:

I wrote a little about this before on my blog, what do you make of the accusation that Tolkien plagiarized the Kalevala with the Narn? I've seen a couple comments to that extent (not on tumblr), and I thought it would be wise to consult an actual Finnish fan on the matter. :)

Interesting question! I apologize in advance for the lengthy reply that follows.

It certainly is true that Tolkien was inspired by Kalevala quite a lot, to say the least, as he himself admitted. But who owns myths anyway,  and what has copyright? Borrowing from mythologies is as far as I know not considered as actual plagiarizing, and surely in that case a much greater fault would be for example that most of the names of the Dwarves in The Hobbit are actually copied from the Norse Edda. Slight similarities between Tolkien’s world and Finland’s national epic ought to be excused, but as some subjects with great identity value for a people can become a touchy subject, I suppose some could disagree. Yet I don’t think Finns themselves take it that personally.

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Dec 26th - Aerin and Morwen

Drabble Not-Advent Calendar

YEAH THAT’S RIGHT. IT’S NOT OVER. I’m sorry, there are too many cool people in this fandom, it’s not my fault.

 Happy not-Christmas-any-more, Margot! Sorry you had to wait so long, I got a teeeeny bit carried away. Underappreciated women in the Children of Húrin though!!!

Note: Aerin is in a forced marriage with Brodda - nothing explicitly mentioned, but felt I should point that out just in case.There’s rape and abuse going on in her life even if it’s not described here.

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It seems plausible that movie!Thranduil married a Sinda, based on his opinion of ‘lowly Silvan’ Elves. But I refuse to accept that that’s true of book!Thranduil. Additionally, the name 'Legolas’ is Silvan; proper Sindarin would be Laegolas. Based on that, I’ve personally always headcanoned that Legolas’ mother was Silvan. But I suppose she could have been of Gondolin or descended from its refugees.

I’m personally rather attached to my headcanons about Thranduil and his wife, but I take no issue with anyone who wants to adopt Gondolin ancestry based on the movies. 

Oropher could also have had kin in Gondolin, for that matter. (Honestly, if I had to guess, I think it’s far likelier Oropher had kin in Gondolin than Legolas’ unspecified mother. We know for sure that Oropher was in Beleriand at the right time, at least, and he’s at least a  Sinda.)

But I do think the use of that line in the movies indicates an attitude by Jackson’s creative team of 'what’s most emotionally resonant right now’ instead of what actually fits well with Tolkien’s universe. It did make me flinch. 

Objecting to that line on the grounds that it’s a slight against the people of Gondolin, on the other hand, is deeply bizarre. And some of the objections I’ve seen have had a tone of 'I’m a real Tolkien fan because I know better’ which is obnoxious.

I wish that people eager to discuss the construction of cultural exchange, race, and history in Tolkien’s legendarium would speak up more often. But I also wish that they’d be far more careful with their words.

adenydd  asked:

grr implied noldor supremacy grinds my gears so much. also 'cultural appropriation' do you even know what that is.

I didn’t even go there because I wanted to be diplomatic and avoid an argument

I’m awarding myself this medal

I see so much misuse of terminology in this fandom that I think I’ve just started doing the equivalent of sticking my fingers in my ears and going LALALALA I’LL IGNORE THAT

this is how I preserve my peace of mind


I’m trying my best not to become That Angry Sinda Stan, but my patience is tested on such a regular basis that I feel as though I’m fighting a losing battle

adenydd  asked:

opinion: turgon was a terrible ruler

strongly agree| agree | neutral | disagree | strongly disagree

Umm, I think there were far shittier rulers (and worst people as personal morality failures, hello most later kings of Númenor). Isolationist policy was successful until it spectacularly wasn’t- though permanently hidden cities strike me as bad policy. (As preserving a piece of elven society as part of the game plan to lead to Tuor and Eärendil, I can see the point I guess, but to not abandon it was faulty and the idea that it could be hidden indefinitely is height of unrealistic).

I see a huge difference between Doirath/Thingol and Gondolin/Turgon, let’s just say. And Finrod versus Turgon is also unfair comparison. (Sorry, but handling of Fens of Serech trumps Huor and Húrin’s last stand, no mater how badass Húrin’s forty trolls is.)

But Turgon did his best and I don’t hold much against him. I like him and think he was smarter than Fingon by a long shot.

11 Questions Meme

Rules Always post the rules // Answer the questions of the person who tagged you and write 11 new ones // Tag 11 people and link them // Let them know they’ve been tagged.

Right, so I was tagged by chilliberry.
I hope I can in my turn tag people who haven’t already been bugged by this meme too many times. But if somebody doesnt want to answer the questions, I won’t mind if you don’t.

Tagging alphabetically: adenydd | aviva0017 | awildellethappears | hereff | huinare | idleleaves | lorienscribe | mirkwoodstock | nelayn | ochazuke | talktob3cks |

Questions will be at end of post.Now my answers to chilliberry’s questions:

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adenydd  asked:

I absolutely believe the canon supports that the sons of Feanor (and even Feanor) have huge guilt complexes -- would love to read meta on this, as Maglor (and to a lesser extent Maedhros) are the only two who seemed guilty from my perspective.

So would I! 

OMG that’s a terrible cop-out I’m a terrible person.

I would love to explore this, because yeah, I was mainly thinking of the one who commits suicide and the one who spends the rest of his life singing sad songs on the beach as the Obviously Feeling Guilty Ones, but I’m sure a case can be made for Feanor as well as the other sons individually as well (and if not, only because they are under-developed as characters anyway). And I’ll try not to say just because they should feel guilty. :P 

I’ll put it on my list of metas to think about, but if anyone has any thoughts, let me know or tag me in your post! 

Edit: this is in response to this post, where I just realized in #6 I forgot to continue my train of thought (which has been covered better elsewhere). But it’s worth repeating that Feanorian apologists are not trying to excuse what the Feanorians did, but merely explain the circumstances and reasons. Kinslaying is still bad no matter who you are. But can we only blame the Feanorians? Are other people to blame for situations escalating to warfare? Have other “good” characters also done reprehensible things which the narrative glosses over because they’re “good” (not-Feanor, not-Celegorm/Curufin/Caranthir whom the narrative seems to portray with comic villain handlebar moustaches)?

My unpopular opinion here is that it’s just sort of over-the-top to be anti-Feanor. Like, well done, you read the book. That’s the LCD interpretation, the most natural reaction to the way the story is told. It takes more effort and careful thought to consider the Maybe He’s Not As Bad As We All Thought side of the issue, and that is more appealing and interesting to some people. 

#maybe I’ll get some proper hatemail this time

Adenydd is an amazing Mizzie and I still don’t know how I managed to gain her as one of my followers because I feel like my blog is so incredibly unquality compared to hers. She’s so sweet and kind to everyone on here (me included) and I hope she never leaves this fandom or there will be a large gaping hole left where she was.