Spartacus Farewell meme: Tiberius/Sabinus [4/5 pairings] ↳ “I would not have you from my side in this, Sabinus.”
Let’s look at two little snippets from the Chantry attack scene.
- Hawke: “You’re a murderer! The grand cleric, the mages… their blood is on your hands.”
- Anders: “I know.”
Emphasis mine. Hawke literally tells him that the blood of the Kirkwall Circle mages is on his hands, and Anders agrees.
Next significant lines:
- Hawke: “So you start a massacre to prove a point?”
- Anders: “I’m not proving a point! I’m changing the world!”
Notice that he corrects Hawke on his reason for starting a massacre and at no point denies that he did start a massacre.
Orsino calls him out on this, too. Anders knew very well that he was throwing the Kirkwall Circle to the wolves. That was his plan. I don’t know where this myth that he blew up the Chantry to save them came from, but nothing could be further from the truth.
If Karras is still alive in Act Three, he’ll mention that Meredith sent for the Right of Annulment from the Divine. According to The World of Thedas Volume One and what Knight-Commander Greagoir says in DAO, the Grand Cleric is the one with the power to invoke the Right. Elthina was refusing to try solving the situation with violence. Say what you will about her, but she did not want a mass slaughter. Meredith was directly trying to get around this by going over the Grand Cleric to the Divine. The point of killing Elthina and the other Chantry sisters was to make Knight-Commander was the Chantry authority in Kirkwall capable of invoking and carrying out the Right. The point of killing them in such a huge public spectacle was to cause a demand for Meredith to invoke the Right. Anders was literally giving Meredith what she wanted in order to use the mages as martyrs for his cause. No, he wasn’t trying to save them at all. And by involving Hawke and the others, he was getting them blamed and most likely killed as well. But oh yes, please tell me about how Anders cares about mages.
I’d like to remind anyone reading this that I collect all forms of DA2 meta, even the stuff that contradicts the other stuff. Anders is one of the most difficult characterizations in the game. He was designed to be that way. My reblogging this is in no way a thrown gauntlet.
I want to get differing opinions and insights on my blog. This is what I intended it for; I’m new to the fandom and the characterizations in DA2 are complex. I’d be a fool if I didn’t take advantage of the years of work and thought the fandom has already given to DA2. I hope I don’t lose any followers because I do this. I value everyone I follow and everyone who follows me highly.
Thanks.
Ok - then I’ll take advantage of a safe space to say this:
At no point inn the game did I ever want to romance Anders. I didn’t particularly care for him right from the start. He is easily the most complex and infuriating character in the game. (So I’m traveling with an abomination?)
When he kills Ella in the Dissent quest I was so mad I was beside myself. From a strictly RPG stand point, my rogue Hawke with the attitude problem would have ‘kicked him out of the club’ after that. The only reason I ever went to talk to him again was because I wanted to see where Bioware was taking me.
Where did they take me? - To the World Trade Center apparently. It was the image that came to mind as I watched the Chantry explode.
I’m a military wifey. I did not reason with the terrorist.
I stabbed him. I was actually happy that I could kill him.
Next to Anders, Fenris is just a sweet guy working out his shit.
Yes, he knew very well, what he did, and he wanted to do it. This is surprise? Most of people know, what they do and what they want. He wanted to start a revolution. This is a bad thing? After 1000 years of oppression?
But terrorist? No. In Kirkwall the terror was the Chantry itself. Elthina knew Meredith’s practice, she was not blind, she was able to see the tranquils, but she did not open her eyes, or willingly supported Merredith.
Anders also wanted law (Act 3, after the explosion):
Aveline: Just to be clear Anders: when this is over, you will turn yourself in for your crime. Anders: I’m well aware of your commitment to oppression. Aveline: The laws of the land. Fairly applied to everyone. Anders: That…is actually something I’d very much like to see.
But what he saw that was only oppression and the law-breaking: the templars was able to do, what they wanted, no one stopped them, the Cantry failed to comply with its own laws. In Kirkwall the peaceful solution do not existed.
(He not necessarily kill Ella, Hawke able to stop him. Yes, he can be dangerous. This is another theme.)
Given that I regularly see people claim that Anders was acting to protect the Kirkwall Circle mages, yes, I’d say it is news.
Yes. Yes, murdering innocent people is a bad thing. Even after 1,000 years of oppression. Especially if the people you’re deliberately inciting violence against are the ones being oppressed.
It’s terribly convenient that Anders is all for hypothetical law. Hypothetical law isn’t going to punish him for his crimes. I’m well aware that Kirkwall justice is biased, but that doesn’t change the fact that Anders is a guilty man who claims to be all for justice but makes it clear in that banter that he has no interest in ever actually facing it as it applies to himself.
Oh. I see. A peaceful solution did not exist? So that’s why we murder the victims, and maybe a few hundred bistanders! It all makes sense now. What a good solution. :) Wow. It’s amazing how much that solved. :) Mages are definitely not being killed and sold into slavery in Inquisition. :) We definitely do not have it straight from the mouth of a mage that the situation for mages in southern Thedas has gotten worse as a result of Anders’ actions. :)
Oh well, as long as he doesn’t always murder a teenage girl for insulting him. (Anders being dangerous is not at all irrelevant.)
He protected many mages, and many people in Kirkwall, for years. But he arrived in Kirkwall for Karl. Finally his purpose was the revolution, this wasn’t clear? Even Anders said to Hawke that “easy to support freedom, until no one to died to achieve it”.
You can say one peaceful solution in Kirkwall? (Anders searched for it for seven years) Elthina didn’t care about mages, didn’t care about the whole world, only thing, what about he cared, the eternity. What do you think: Anders knew about, what the mages will do in the near future? No. He just started a revolution in Kirkwall (and –with Hawke– he helped the mages in the other Circles to free themselves – optional). I don’t think, that he would responsible for Fiona’s acts.
(I don’t said, that Ella’s possible death is irrelevant, I said, this is other theme.)
“He protected many mages, and many people in Kirkwall, for years.”
I don’t care. ‘It doesn’t matter that I did this one horrifyingly bad thing because I did all of these good things!’ is something I’ve seen abusers and all other manner of horrible people pull before, and it doesn’t work for me. You aren’t allowed one free murder for every orphan that you save. Lives are not currency to be bought and traded.
Your demand that I come up with a peaceful solution hinges on the idea that what Anders did actually solved something. It didn’t. The Kirkwall mages are fucked even if Hawke wins. They’re wanted fugitives with no money, no supplies, limited knowledge of how to survive outside of the Circle, and nowhere to go. That’s the best case scenario.
But let’s try this:
- Anders (and probably Hawke as well) gets off his fucking high horse and works with the revolution that was already in place. The one being led by Circle mages. Grace’s weird revenge plot ends before it begins, because no one would believe Hawke was working against them when one of Hawke’s closest associates (and possibly Hawke themself) was already working with them. Meredith gets overthrown, and Thrask becomes Knight-Commander and builds a better Circle. Would it be bloodless? Probably not. But it would limit the death toll to only those who joined the fight–on either side–of their own free will.
Alternately:
- Anders murders Meredith, and Meredith alone, and immediately turns himself for doing so. Cullen, who has been growing progressively more liberal as he gets farther away from his trauma, now becomes Knight-Commander. (He probably executes Anders. And no one else.) Things in the Gallows improve, perhaps not as drastically as we’d like, but enough to keep everyone alive. Death count? 2.
Distinctly possible, if out of Anders’ hands:
- Anders does nothing and waits until he thinks of a better fucking idea than “kill them all and let the Maker sort them out.” Meredith’s request for the Right of Annulment gets denied. She tries to invoke it anyway. Cullen immediately has a right and arguably a duty to remove her from her post for defying the Chantry. At worst the Templars end up fighting each other instead and don’t have the number left to Annul anything even if they wanted to. At best, Meredith’s lyrium sickness is widely recognized and there is a relatively peaceful transition to new and hopefully gentler leadership in the Gallows.
I don’t necessarily recommend doing nothing in such circumstances; I’m just pointing out that doing nothing may very well have worked out better for the mages than Anders’ actual course of action did.
Are you really suggesting that it’s laudable to start a war with no consideration for the future consequences? As much as I hated Hawke being turned into an NPC in Inquisition, I think they put it best themself: “That’s what happens when you try to change things: Things change. You can’t always control how.” It’s not so much that Anders is directly responsible for Fiona’s actions as it is that Anders made a unilateral decision for a large group of people and ended up making things a lot worse for many of them, and he does have to take responsibility for that.
Varric says the Circle mages kicked Anders out because a lot of them hated him for what he did to them.
Ella’s death isn’t really another topic at all: It’s entirely related to how Vengeance took Anders over and began to overrule is logical reasoning abilities and his priorities, and it alone justifies @latetovarricsparty stabbing Anders. Because he attacked a child in front of you.
Thank you @archdemonblood - I really appreciate the understanding.
Really I couldn’t have put it any better.
Also don’t know if it got mentioned before and i simply overread it : “ He wanted to start a revolution. This is a bad thing? After 1000 years of oppression?But terrorist? No.” Blowing up a chantry with tons of innocent people inside is the kind of thing that is the exact definition of a terroistic act. And it just gets worse if you look at how Anders knew that even more than just killing one large amount of innocent people, he indirectly doomed tons of other innocent people - the mages - who would be blamed for his very own deed. Even more ironic the people he was so passionate about protecting, suddenly dont matter to him at all anymore? Im quite sure he actually states himself that he wanted a war between the templars and the mages, thats the whole reasoning behind doing what he did anyway. Mages usually can fight, yeah, but templars do too. And not all mages have equal power, there are a lot of mages that just have a tiny bit of magic - not enough to defend themselves at all. While all working templars are capable of handling a fight, and killing mages specifically. So yeah, he doomed a lot of them on top of killing thousand of innocents people, and if that wasnt gross enough he also backstabbed Hawke and actually made hawke help him with this shit, even if hawke didnt know what it was for - cause he trusted anders. Like, how much worse can a betrayal get? For someone posessed by a spirit of justice this sure is injust.
I also love how the other person started thinking off alternate endings that could have come up if anders didnt do his gross thing.. They all sound so beautifully logic & possible. It makes me really wonder how things would have turned out without Anders fucking it up for everbody involved.
Anders was the greatest enemy to his own cause. Not even Meredith, Alrik, and Karras combined fucked over as many mages (as well other innocent civilians caught in the crossfire and killed by the wreckage of the explosion) as Anders did. That’s what makes him such an interesting villain, but it doesn’t change the fact that what he did was terrorism by the very basic definition of the word.
Someone finally did a comic for that D&D facebook post.
That was marvelous! Loved it.
I’ve waited my whole life for this post
I don’t normally reblog things twice but this… this.
THE ONLY ROMANCE GUIDE YOU WILL NEED
i love dragon age but do you see my problem
and of course Patrick Weekes response
a sweet cinnamon roll too good for this world
“Vivienne saying that mages in her circle could leave it anytime invalidates And/erz and his struggle in a lot of ways, and I hate her for it”
Still more from the lovely stans
Are they already ignoring the fact that Wynne left without so much as filling out a leave of absence paperwork in DAO? Or all the evidence across three games that paints him as an extremist who does not speak for all mages and does not have their best interests in mind?
Of course they are. How else can you think he’s right unless you totally ignore all facts. It also seems like the a lot of circles - Kniloch hold, Ostwick circle and Vivienne’s circle all relatively chill, especially when compared to Kirkwalll. If DA2 was happening in Ostwick and not in Kirkwall, so many more people would have realized how completely unreasonable their fave is.
Even the Gallows lets Circle Mage Bethany leave temporarily if you take her along on the Legacy and Mark of the Assassin DLCs. In Legacy she specifically mentions that it was ok for her to leave for a brief while. What Kirkwall does have are the extremists, both Templar and Mage, and Anders is one of them.
And yet Tempalr extremist are “the worst”™ and Mage extremists are celebrated. Oh, right, “oppreshunnn” and such
I was wondering about this myself. Kirkwall’s circle is really ‘bad’, but Bethany can leave, and when questioned, she sticks by the circle and indicates she is staying by choice. Also Feynriel can apply for a transfer to Tevinter for better training and actually go. This means Meredith willingly set Feynriel free and sent a Somniari to the Black Divine. Granted he did not have to tell anyone he was a Somniari and could kill people in their dreams, and maybe influenced people in thier dreams in order to get the transfer, or got Hawke to vouch for him… but still…
anti-colonialist hero Austin Powers maims imperial pig propaganda project
I love this edit because it looks like Powers is sneaking up on Bond, possibly to snap his neck
Okay, but I've actually seen the Austin Powers movies, and know what their plots is about. James Bond? Whomst? Never seen one of the movies, even in part, but I do know I don't actually care to.
The fact that Austin Powers is more culturally significant is actively hilarious.
I like in the Fellowship of the Rings where they are standing outside the big ass door with the riddle “Speak friend and enter” thing.
And then they’re like, what’s friend in elvish and Legolas just stands there and says nothing.
Frodo: *looks at Gandalf*
Everyone else: *looks at Legolas*
Legolas: [internally] fuck you, in Eregion they spoke a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT kind of elvish, I grew up with like ten different dialects of silvan, this word is pronounced differently in every one of them, this sindarin and my sindarin probably wouldn’t even be a little bit compatible, who fucking knows the door might want it in Quenya, you know what it’s probably in Khuzdul, that’s the kind of language you’d want a password to be in, the one nobody knows, fuck they’re all looking at me I don’t know this there are dozens of different languages spoken by elves you stupid fucks
Legolas: [externally] silence
Gandalf: “…Mellon”
Everyone: *thinks Legolas is stupid*
This is officially one of my favorite tumblr posts.
Aragorn, also fluent in at least two kinds of Elvish different from the ones Legolas knows and also Khuzdul: *also completely silent, but pointedly stares at Gandalf*
(i just want to know im not alone with my weird hands)
for those wondering, i can only do it with my thumb and pinky and i'm better at it with my right hand than i am with my left
So, sometimes dolls will have eyes that discolor. (Either due to being poorly stored - in hot environments, for example - or just because they kind of sucked to begin with and time passed.)
Life of Faith was a "Christian alternative" to American Girl in the early 00s. (These spring up from time to time. Most of them only last a few years with a very niche market. I think, at the time, they had because people were flipping out about American Girl partnering with Girls Inc to fund after-school science programs and stuff, because Girls Inc was - according to the conservatives - "A pro-abortion, pro-lesbian organization".) The dolls were based around the Elsie Dinsmore books and it's all . . . big fluffy dresses on a plantation in the antebellum South. With all that that entails.
It was pretty fucking bad.
With that in mind, this is perhaps the funniest toy defect I have ever seen.
Sorry, ELSIE DINSMORE DOLLS
WHAT
okay yes it is fair to say that elsie dinsmore books are bad because they're christian novels set in the antebellum south. and that is 110% true. but that does not convey how fucking bonkers they are. elsie is a Good Christian Girl who wants nothing more than a good spanking from her daddy. she and her daddy are so obsessed with obedience that even my most conservative homeschool group's most conservative homemaker mom said "they seem a little overboard on the focus on obedience." like when the james dobson contingent says that, you know it's excessive. elsie grows to marriagable age and becomes betrothed to her father's best friend who is however many decades her senior, and she thinks that is all beautiful and good except she will simply be inconsolable being taken from her daddy's kisses. i'm pretty sure somebody brings up that it will now be elsie's husband's responsibility to dole out spankings for naughty behavior. they go on their honeymoon and suddenly the book turns into anti-mormon diatribes?
if martha finley was alive today she'd be too busy dominating certain dead dove-associated tags on ao3 to ever publish any of this
the reason i own several of these books is because a friend decided that they were too dangerous to release to a thrift store and the young impressionable minds that might find them there
AND APPARENTLY DOLLS BASED AROUND ELSIE DINSMORE WERE PRODUCED AT SOME POINT AND THEY HAVE GLOWING RED EYES
The other day I saw a YouTuber I follow make a text post that said almost verbatim "sometimes I when I watch a thought provoking movie, I find I think about it for several days afterwards." the highlighted comment was someone saying "I think that's called hyperfixation?"
People seem to be increasingly oblivious to the difference between thinking about or liking something, fixating or focusing on it, and /hyper/fixation as a disxriptor of the extreme of this that occurs in neurodivergent people.
If someone reads "I think about things sometimes" and sees "hyperfixation", then I can totally see it following that "I think about people sometimes" becomes synonymous with "I am an obsessive creepy stalker with no boundaries"
Which. Sure is something.
Obviously the trend of people being weird about 'you need consent to have a crush, but also crushes are a sin' has been a slow rolling train wreck for a few years now, but seeing that YouTube comment made something click for me
Btw if I say things like “by god” or “good lord” in posts please be aware I don’t mean it in a catholic way I mean it in a 1950s scientist reacting in horror after they create an evil creature in the lab set in the distant future year of 2005
io che nonostante sia atea dica “grazie agli dei” e simili perché si io non credo in niente ma miliardi di persone hanno religioni e dei differenti ed io non voglio far sentire escluso nessuno
im frankly lucky the above reblog is about how theyre an atheist because there is nothing more terrifying than saying something slightly blasphemous and seeing a paragraph of italian in your replies
"It seems to me that I am about to shoot a flower"
Enjolras past lives
Sometimes a fanon interpretation shared by so many people will gaslight you into thinking YOU're not smart enough to understand it when, in reality, no, the collective of a fandom can indeed just be misinterpreting a character beyond parody. It's not you, it's them
For those of you who want to lock all of your works with all the silly AI scraping of AO3 (which AO3 is recommending you lock your works, as stated in this post)
Here is a quick and easy guide of how to edit ALL of your works at once.
From your Dashboard click on “edit works” on the far right. This will bring up all of your works that you can select.
Select all the works you want to edit, then hit “Edit” at the bottom right.
Scroll to nearly the bottom of the page where you find “Visibility” and select “only show to registered users” and then update at the bottom.
That’s it, all of your works have now been locked without having to go in and edit each fic individually.
I hope this helps!









